HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

[ivtec]

Hi guys my friend has an HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS server when everyone else is connected

[stj]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

use a live disk and try again - to determine if it's hardware or software

[Curious.George]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

Hi guys my friend has an HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS server when everyone else is connected

DNS is transactional -- you don't "connect" to it for any longer than it takes to issue a query. In most cases, UDP is used as the transport protocol (so, a message fits in a single datagram).

Are you sure you're not thinking about prematurely dropping its DHCP lease? (DHCP is a different protocol and service than DNS)

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

The internet in general, uses TCP.

UDP a lot of the time, is used for gaming, example: Halo CE

[Curious.George]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

The internet in general, uses TCP.

DNS uses UDP -- unless the response exceeds the size of the datagram (i.e., too many answers).

[ANY is being deprecated/ignored in part to clip the size of replies so they fit in the nominal datagram payload]

DNS servers use TCP to transfer zone information between themselves (secondaries querying primaries).

The DNS protocol uses UDP datagrams because it is connectionless, you're issuing a single request and expecting a single reply. The reply isn't tied to the request by a connection in the network stack. Instead, the client looks at incoming messages FROM that server to see if one of them satisfies its most recent request.

Everything about the query can fit neatly into a single datagram. If you want to resolve 50 different names, you issue 50 different queries. You're not "connecting" to a service, engaging in lots of interaction and then disconnecting from it.

As there is no connection involved, there's less cost on the server (in the stack) to set up and maintain that connection -- waiting for "more traffic" from EACH client. The network stack (in the client AND the server) doesn't try to track the state of that "connection" because there is none -- each request is self-contained (and, if it gets LOST, the stack doesn't care or try to retransmit it)

Also because of this lack of a connection, its up to the DNS client to watch for the expected reply to its query and, if necessary, reissue the request if one doesn't appear, when expected.

This is comparable to mailing a letter. The post office TRIES to deliver it. But, makes no guarantee (in their "standard" service). If you were expecting a reply and didn't get one, its up to YOU to resend (another copy of) the letter.

If you want guaranteed delivery, the post office charges extra -- because IT now assumes the responsibility of ensuring the letter makes it to its intended recipient.

So, I repeat, the OP's computer isn't having trouble "disconnecting from the DNS server" cuz it never "connected".

UDP a lot of the time, is used for gaming, example: Halo CE

Because its more efficient. The last thing a game wants to do is spend CPU cycles dealing with an expensive network protocol.

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

"and, if it gets LOST, the stack doesn't care or try to retransmit it"

I suspect that's why online gaming has some issues:

Such as, Halo CE randomly having an exception or the UI falsely reports the admin shutting down the game.

Or of course, getting semi-desync'ed, either the responses don't seem correct for some players in the game or you keep jumping around.

[Curious.George]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

"and, if it gets LOST, the stack doesn't care or try to retransmit it"

I suspect that's why online gaming has some issues:

Such as, Halo CE randomly having an exception or the UI falsely reports the admin shutting down the game.

Or of course, getting semi-desync'ed, either the responses don't seem correct for some players in the game or you keep jumping around.

TCP also ensures in-order delivery of packets. Anything that's UDP-based doesn't ensure that ordering. So, even if none of the UDP datagrams get "lost", they can arrive out-of-order and confuse a model that thinks events happen in a specific linear order.

So, the message that says you fired your gun could arrive after the message that represents the player dying! (!) The game then has to make sense out of this bizarre chronology.

UDP affords its speed by putting more responsibility on the client to make sense of what the SERIES of messages might mean.

Services like P2P can exploit UDP because the nature of the protocol will inherently cause a peer to (re)request a packet if it doesn't arrive (because a peer may drop out of the swarm at any time so you wouldn't RELY on it fulfilling your request!)

(For DNS queries, you really don't care what order the messages arrive; each "stands alone" and its meaning doesn't really change based on the messages that may have preceded it)

But, the difference in efficiency/cost is HUGE! You can ALMOST implement UDP on an abacus... you just toss your data onto the wind (ether!) and HOPE it gets where it needs to go :-/

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

So, the message that says you fired your gun could arrive after the message that represents the player dying! (!)

Well, in Halo CE, I often do get a kill after being killed by another player, when I kill with a grenade or a rocket.

But Halo CE seems to have a strange thing with sniper rifles and possibly pistols as well:

The player with the higher ping gets the kill when the one with the lower ping keeps getting killed by the higher pinger! Yikes! I suspect that Halo CE also has a reverse-bias thing, too, where it seems to reject a hit for one with a lower ping, like I normally have.

And presto, you got the "Double-digit pinger gets whopped by a 240 ms'er player phenomenon"!

[Curious.George]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

Well, in Halo CE, I often do get a kill after being killed by another player, when I kill with a grenade or a rocket.

Depending on circumstances, one could argue that this is legitimate -- you launched the rocket/grenade while you were still alive (and it just took a while to reach its target).

I don't play online games so I can't fashion a good example. My point is just that UDP makes no guarantees of datagram delivery order. If you send one datagram and it makes its way to its destination via some temporally longer path than the next datagram, the second could arrive at the destination before the first. (imagine a transient hiccup in the network fabric caused the first datagram to be routed via a "longer" route because the prefered route was congested, at the time)

But Halo CE seems to have a strange thing with sniper rifles and possibly pistols as well:

The player with the higher ping gets the kill when the one with the lower ping keeps getting killed by the higher pinger! Yikes! I suspect that Halo CE also has a reverse-bias thing, too, where it seems to reject a hit for one with a lower ping, like I normally have.

And presto, you got the "Double-digit pinger gets whopped by a 240 ms'er player phenomenon"!

I suspect the issue has many subtleties involved. As you aren't just trying to serialize messages froma single host (to another host) but, rather, are trying to serialize the SET of messages from many hosts to a (large) set of hosts.

I have many hosts here (> 100) that are tied together into a distributed system. It's important that they be able to understand what order "events" have occurred, even when they are occurring on different hosts. (e.g., did the file get deleted by hostA before or after it was saved by hostB)

So, all of those hosts have to agree on a shared sense of time in order to be able to make sense of the timestamps that are applied to those events. And, you can only imply an ordering of those events if your clocks are synchronized to a finer degree than the events you are reporting!

For example, if you can only synchronize your clocks to 1 second precision, then anything that happens closer in time than one second can't be ordered properly. Something claiming to occur at 12:34:56 on host A could, in fact, have happened BEFORE some other thing reported (by hostB) as having happened at 12:34:55! OTOH, it will be known to have definitely occurred after an event reported by hostC at 12:34:54 and before an event on hostD reported at 12:34:58.

(I synchronize to better than a microsecond because most of the "events" are being generated by computers, not humans pulling "triggers", etc.).

[stj]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

hmmm.

tcp has error correction, udp does not.
mabe you have a bad cable or a cable is running parallel to a mains cable and is picking up noise?

[RJARRRPCGP]

Re: HP desktop 110-210 and it's slow and keeps disconnecting from the DNS

Depending on circumstances, one could argue that this is legitimate -- you launched the rocket/grenade while you were still alive (and it just took a while to reach its target).

I don't have a problem with that. Also, that would simply result in the "StreetFighter2-double-KO-like-phenomenon", LOL