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Old 03-31-2021, 02:24 PM   #1
dominik0801
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Default IR6500 problems, any tips?

Hello everyone.

Recently I bought the LY IR6500 machine, since I want to get into BGA rework to expand my business.
I know it's a cheap machine to others, it was expensive to me, and I expected more.

I have already removed the bottom heater glass, as others mentioned, and it helped a bit..

But I have quite lot of problems with it so far.

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First of all, the default patterns are all garbage, too fast, all the boards got popcorned when I first tried to desolder BGA packages, even when I followed every step and instructions of the machine manual.

I already made my own pattern with some help of a friend who also does BGA (different machine, but same controller). He said, that the heating elements are different, but he desoldered and soldered 2000+ BGA packages since he got into it, and he never had any problems.

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Second of all, even when the heating is really slow (like, 0.38 celsius / second), the top heater STILL suffers to keep up with the set temperature, so it starts to glow to reach the right temperature, of course this also popcorned many of my practice boards and chips..
there's absolutely no air flow in my room, the thermocouple is RIGHT next to the chip, and the top heating element is really close to the chip, but I tried many different heights, nothing worked as expected..

Sometimes the set temperature is, say, 200 celsius. The board reaches 200 degrees, then it jumps over to, like 208 degrees, slowly decreases to the set temperature, but then it also goes UNDER it, say to 196, then it suffers again to reach 200 degress, of course all while GLOWING and BURNING my chips.

While glowing, I also noticed, that one part of the heating element is glowing orange really bright, while a few spots are dark/not glowing. Are those cold spots?

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Third problem is that sometimes I can desolder chips when its supposed to be at 215c, then the cips WON'T EVEN MOVE a bit, when I already had 240c over it for 1 minutes straight.. what?!

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Fourth problem.. today I managed to desolder then resolder another GPU on a laptop motherboard, which weirdly WORKED! :O

But I don't know how, since the machine did NOT solder it on correctly.
One corner sinked succesfully, while the other corner did not.
I had to run the program 2 other times again, when all the solder balls finally soldered (but it still was not seated good).

I noticed, that the top heater's heating element is not laying straight, it has a "slope", it's also problematic, right?

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Am I putting the thermocouple or top heater at bad positions/distances?

Could these be problems with the top heating element, and/or the thermocouple?

I read that many replaced the top heating element with an "ELSTEIN RFS80", but I can NOT find that anywhere.
I saw that the IR9000 uses the "elstein HTS/4" element, which I could find and I would buy. But is it better?

I have so many questions, but it's hard to think about them all now.
Any help is appreciated, I am really desperate right now.
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Old 04-20-2021, 09:53 AM   #2
paul362
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Default Re: IR6500 problems, any tips?

I am having the very same problems with my IR PRO-SC the bottom heaters are all over the place if you measure them with a digital laser heat gun and my top heater is the same as yours ! with the same results,my next move is to find some decent ceramics for the top and bottom heaters if anyone can reccoment some this would be appreciated.
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Old 04-21-2021, 02:26 AM   #3
diif
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Default Re: IR6500 problems, any tips?

I put a Elstein RFS80 in my Scotle/Scotle clone. I've been very happy with it.
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Old 05-09-2021, 04:06 PM   #4
dominik0801
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Default Re: IR6500 problems, any tips?

Quote:
Originally Posted by diif View Post
I put a Elstein RFS80 in my Scotle/Scotle clone. I've been very happy with it.
I just got my Elstein and put it in the place of the old heater.
Can you recommend me a distance that should be between the chip and the heater element?

The original manual for the IR6500 says 2cm, how correct is that?
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Old 05-09-2021, 04:22 PM   #5
diif
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Default Re: IR6500 problems, any tips?

Yeah, somewhere between 2cm and 3cm.
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Old 05-10-2021, 04:18 PM   #6
Chispaburgos
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Default Re: IR6500 problems, any tips?

Estimates, I work in reballing and I notice that in the narration of the problem you do not mention the height at which you have the upper IR of the plate, nor if you have performed the calibration of the refracting plates. On the other hand, you should always use flux to desolder, you don't indicate which one you use, you probably don't have the right one. Regarding the heat curves, you must consider that there are solders with lead and without lead and for each one there are different curves to use, before putting a plate you must know which solder you are facing, to correctly set your equipment one that at 220 you have liquefaction and in another you must reach 245 . Attach images of how you work to make yourself feel better. where you put the thermocouple when you work, the upper IR distance and lower IR temperature settings.
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Old 05-18-2021, 04:37 AM   #7
Pake64
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Default Re: IR6500 problems, any tips?

Where i can find elstein rfs80? I can NOT find that anywhere.
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Old 05-19-2021, 02:45 PM   #8
dominik0801
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Default Re: IR6500 problems, any tips?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chispaburgos View Post
Estimates, I work in reballing and I notice that in the narration of the problem you do not mention the height at which you have the upper IR of the plate, nor if you have performed the calibration of the refracting plates. On the other hand, you should always use flux to desolder, you don't indicate which one you use, you probably don't have the right one. Regarding the heat curves, you must consider that there are solders with lead and without lead and for each one there are different curves to use, before putting a plate you must know which solder you are facing, to correctly set your equipment one that at 220 you have liquefaction and in another you must reach 245 . Attach images of how you work to make yourself feel better. where you put the thermocouple when you work, the upper IR distance and lower IR temperature settings.
I always try to keep the middle of the chip at the middle of the top heater, relative to the arrows on the sides and front of the top heater.

Since I couldn't find the Elstein plate everyone uses, i got an elstein hts/4.
The distance between the plate and the board is usually 2cm.

Bottom heater is set to 240 celsius.

The thermocouple is always right next to the chip, it touches it.

My flux is an Amtech nc-559-asm.

I did not perform any calibrations, i dont really know what that means and how to do it.

Another question: is there any difference in white and black IR plates?
I feel like my 250W white 6x6cm elstein glows much more, than the stock 400W black 8x8cm one.

Last edited by dominik0801; 05-19-2021 at 02:46 PM..
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Old 07-06-2021, 03:47 PM   #9
newbie_unlocker
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Default Re: IR6500 problems, any tips?

calibration is pid the 6500 manual does have an auto facility but can cause issues between the two pid controllers. also a pointless exercise is when trying to copy other users settings which will not be accurate. first and foremost you need to make sure your machine is 100% level then find out what the average temperature is in the room where the machine is..report back with the temp then I can begin to help you.
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