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    kzg / ost

    I have a MSI 7032 v1 (K8M Neo - V) main board. It has rubicons, ost, and kzg. I don't see any bulging caps, they all look good. But I read elsewhere that kzg were a problematic series.

    Should I worry about the kzg 10v 1000uf (8mm x 14mm)? Or the ost 6.3v 1500uf (8mm x 20mm)?

    I don't have a CPU to test this board with yet ...

    #2
    Re: kzg / ost

    both, replace them both. bonez will probably be posting here today about which ones you should replace them with
    Cap Datasheet Depot: http://www.paullinebarger.net/DS/
    ^If you have datasheets not listed PM me

    Comment


      #3
      Re: kzg / ost

      Yup. If you want to get it going. Replace both the OSTs and the KZGs, since they are both problematic.
      I love putting bad caps and flat batteries in fire and watching them explode!!

      No wonder it doesn't work! You installed the jumper wires backwards

      Main PC: Core i7 3770K 3.5GHz, Gigabyte GA-Z77M-D3H-MVP, 8GB Kingston HyperX DDR3 1600, 240GB Intel 335 Series SSD, 750GB WD HDD, Sony Optiarc DVD RW, Palit nVidia GTX660 Ti, CoolerMaster N200 Case, Delta DPS-600MB 600W PSU, Hauppauge TV Tuner, Windows 7 Home Premium

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      Comment


        #4
        Re: kzg / ost

        That's a big job then, about 20 in all. I think I'll set that aside for now.

        I also have an Intel D865perl with 5 bulging caps near the CPU, 6.3v 820uf. Can't read the brand, all I see is HN(M). All others are Rubycon or Nichicon and look fine. I want to see if fixing the 5 bulged ones will stabilize it. It runs, but bluescreens and fails prime95 stress test.

        Comment


          #5
          Re: kzg / ost

          instability is normal for small numbers of bad caps

          I replaced 22 on a linksys srw2048, it is a big job, and having a desoldering tool can help with crappy solder and help things go faster
          Cap Datasheet Depot: http://www.paullinebarger.net/DS/
          ^If you have datasheets not listed PM me

          Comment


            #6
            Re: kzg / ost

            Originally posted by a23d56 View Post
            I also have an Intel D865perl with 5 bulging caps near the CPU, 6.3v 820uf. Can't read the brand, all I see is HN(M).
            HN is Nichicon. They failed due to a manufacturing defect that existed prior to 2005.

            The 820uF capacitors on this board are extra tall compared to normal 820uF HN capacitors. I'd recommend replacing them with 1500uF or 1800uF capacitors. ESR is critical in VRM capacitors, and the ESR depends on the physical size of the capacitor. The extra capacitance won't hurt anything here. Replacing them with smaller 820uF capacitors will raise the ESR and that will cause issues.

            The other option would be to replace them with 680uF polymer caps. I've done a number of Intel 865 boards replacing the electrolytic caps in the VRM with 680uF polymers, matching the polymers that are already there.

            Replace the failed HN and the board has a good chance of becoming stable again. Check the USB ports for proper function. The 865 southbridge is prone to issues there.

            Comment


              #7
              Re: kzg / ost

              Originally posted by c_hegge View Post
              Yup. If you want to get it going. Replace both the OSTs and the KZGs, since they are both problematic.
              Exactly right.
              Both OST and KZG have a nasty habit of failing without bloating.
              Mann-Made Global Warming.
              - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

              -
              Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

              - Dr Seuss
              -
              You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
              -

              Comment


                #8
                Re: kzg / ost

                Originally posted by yyonline View Post
                The 820uF capacitors on this board are extra tall compared to normal 820uF HN capacitors.
                Yes, they appear to be 8mm x 20mm. Looks like I can substitute these:

                https://www.badcaps.net/store/produc...products_id=63

                Thanks for helping a newbie.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: kzg / ost

                  Originally posted by yyonline View Post
                  HN is Nichicon. They failed due to a manufacturing defect that existed prior to 2005.

                  The 820uF capacitors on this board are extra tall compared to normal 820uF HN capacitors. I'd recommend replacing them with 1500uF or 1800uF capacitors. ESR is critical in VRM capacitors, and the ESR depends on the physical size of the capacitor. The extra capacitance won't hurt anything here. Replacing them with smaller 820uF capacitors will raise the ESR and that will cause issues.

                  The other option would be to replace them with 680uF polymer caps. I've done a number of Intel 865 boards replacing the electrolytic caps in the VRM with 680uF polymers, matching the polymers that are already there.

                  Replace the failed HN and the board has a good chance of becoming stable again. Check the USB ports for proper function. The 865 southbridge is prone to issues there.
                  Yes,
                  HM and HN with date codes from 2001-2004 should be considered bad.
                  Date code format is [letter][2 digit year][2 digit week]
                  H0322 - would be week 22 of 2003.

                  Some D865perl had them.

                  Some Intel boards also use 85C caps for the small 4&5mm caps.
                  Those can start going bad after about 4 or 5 years but it depends a great deal on hours actually used and case temp.
                  If they are happy caps in a nice cool system that grandma only drives on weekends they might last 15 years.
                  .
                  Mann-Made Global Warming.
                  - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                  -
                  Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                  - Dr Seuss
                  -
                  You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                  -

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: kzg / ost

                    Originally posted by PCBONEZ View Post
                    Exactly right.
                    Both OST and KZG have a nasty habit of failing without bloating.
                    OK. Gonna start with the Intel board first though. 5 is about all I want to tackle right now.

                    Thanks for the help.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: kzg / ost

                      Originally posted by a23d56 View Post
                      Yes, they appear to be 8mm x 20mm. Looks like I can substitute these:

                      https://www.badcaps.net/store/produc...products_id=63

                      Thanks for helping a newbie.

                      If they are 1800uF and not 16v caps then yes.
                      Mann-Made Global Warming.
                      - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                      -
                      Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                      - Dr Seuss
                      -
                      You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                      -

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: kzg / ost

                        You should replace all the HM and HN.
                        If some have gone over the edge the rest are right on it.
                        .
                        Mann-Made Global Warming.
                        - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                        -
                        Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                        - Dr Seuss
                        -
                        You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                        -

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: kzg / ost

                          Originally posted by PCBONEZ View Post
                          You should replace all the HM and HN.
                          If some have gone over the edge the rest are right on it.
                          .
                          That would be close to 40 total. Whoa. Not sure I want to spend that much money or work that hard.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: kzg / ost

                            That's up to you.
                            You know, you don't have to do them all in one 'sitting'.
                            .
                            Mann-Made Global Warming.
                            - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                            -
                            Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                            - Dr Seuss
                            -
                            You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                            -

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: kzg / ost

                              another little tip: preheat the board with a hairdryer before soldering. helps a lot for the CPU VRM caps on huge heat-sucking ground traces..

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Re: kzg / ost

                                PCBONEZ - to clarify, ALL '05 HM/HN are good?
                                "We have offered them (the Arabs) a sensible way for so many years. But no, they wanted to fight. Fine! We gave them technology, the latest, the kind even Vietnam didn't have. They had double superiority in tanks and aircraft, triple in artillery, and in air defense and anti-tank weapons they had absolute supremacy. And what? Once again they were beaten. Once again they scrammed [sic]. Once again they screamed for us to come save them. Sadat woke me up in the middle of the night twice over the phone, 'Save me!' He demanded to send Soviet troops, and immediately! No! We are not going to fight for them."

                                -Leonid Brezhnev (On the Yom Kippur War)

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Re: kzg / ost

                                  Yes, contrary to paranoid speculation the '05 are good.
                                  I've only heard of two bad '05's and both were on questionable PSUs.

                                  Source of problem was discovered in mid 2004 and was in the International news immediately.
                                  Nichicon even admitted it publicly and recalled the bad ones at that time too.
                                  [At least the bad ones in supply channels.]
                                  They weren't screwing around on the recall because they pissed off some really big names,, like Dell, HP, Apple/MAC, Intel, and, ......

                                  I don't think they made very many in '05 because no one wanted to buy them after that.
                                  For example Mouser dropped HN and HM product lines entirely for several years after that fiasco.
                                  .
                                  Last edited by PCBONEZ; 04-21-2011, 05:33 AM.
                                  Mann-Made Global Warming.
                                  - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                                  -
                                  Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                                  - Dr Seuss
                                  -
                                  You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                                  -

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Re: kzg / ost

                                    Originally posted by PCBONEZ View Post
                                    you don't have to do them all in one 'sitting'.
                                    .
                                    I removed the 5 bulging caps. I had a hard time getting all the solder out of the holes, those little suction thingys don't work for me. So I grabbed a can of compressed air, stuck my iron in the back side of the hole, and blew air in from the other side. Worked great, the holes are all clean now.

                                    I'll invest $10 to fix the board, but that's my limit. If that fails, it's out with the trash.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Re: kzg / ost

                                      I put a SS needle in an exacto knife handle to help clean out the holes.
                                      Iron on one side, needle on the other until it slips through.
                                      Need an all metal handle though. Not one with a plastic Collet.
                                      Homedepot and some hobby/craft stores like Michaels have the all metal ones.
                                      .
                                      Mann-Made Global Warming.
                                      - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                                      -
                                      Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                                      - Dr Seuss
                                      -
                                      You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                                      -

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Re: kzg / ost

                                        Originally posted by a23d56 View Post
                                        I removed the 5 bulging caps. I had a hard time getting all the solder out of the holes, those little suction thingys don't work for me. So I grabbed a can of compressed air, stuck my iron in the back side of the hole, and blew air in from the other side. Worked great, the holes are all clean now.

                                        I'll invest $10 to fix the board, but that's my limit. If that fails, it's out with the trash.
                                        hah, never thought about doing that
                                        Cap Datasheet Depot: http://www.paullinebarger.net/DS/
                                        ^If you have datasheets not listed PM me

                                        Comment

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