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    Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

    A nice fridge with an annoying beep and fault!

    Had this fridge for around 11 years now and it was not fit for purpose from the outset needing manual defrosting. Anyway, I'll cut to the chase.

    It has a Magnetek 4080-02/9 power board for which I cannot find the service manual or any diagrams anywhere.

    So... I buy a Peak ESR70 the other day after reading another thread (please feel free to read my introduction if interested) and decide that the fridge would be a good place to start.

    It has a variety of caps on there. Elna, Teapo (which I note is in your bad list) and some others. I will identify them as necessary.

    The symptoms are that the front LED display simply keeps flashing and the unit beeping. I cannot access the menus to clear the beep and set any temps on the fridge or freezer. Still working (in a fashion) but loathed to throw it out.

    I have very limited electronics knowledge and am here to learn and grow and perhaps one day maybe even answer a question that is useful to a newbie (but that is probably a long way off).

    I discharged all the caps and proceeded to measure them. The Peak ESR70 comes with a very limited typical ESR value chart which ends at 250V. I have a 400V capacitor in there so have NO idea what the ESR should be.

    To kickstart this thread, I wanted to ask about one brown coloured cap in particular. It is rated at 100V 2.2 uF yet it is reading 529.2 uF with an ESR 0.58 Ohms.

    From the very limited knowledge I have gleaned so far, this clearly isn't right but how?

    Without taking the board out again today and looking at the capacitor manufacturer and trying to find the ESR for it on their site I am sure its tolerance isn't +25000%

    Any ideas as to what may have gone wrong with it. I thought caps were supposed to deplete if anything over time?

    #2
    Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

    In circuit or out of it?
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      #3
      Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

      i cant see any pictures - did you attach them?

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        #4
        Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

        In circuit but I am testing with a Peak ESR70.

        I didn't attach pictures because caps looked OK to me but it's raining here so I will take board out again and take some shots of it as I am not going into my workshop in this weather this morning.

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          #5
          Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

          There may be some other capacitor in parallel so you read both, measure out of circuit to be sure.

          BTW I could have had sold you much better ESR meter for lower price. ESR70 is obsolete.
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            #6
            Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

            many caps just dry up inside, no signs of bulging or leekage
            remove the cap from the board and retest

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              #7
              Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

              ESR70 is not obsolete. Peak Electronics are still making it. CapAnalyser 88A is obsolete though he is trying to raise funds to make another 400 pieces.

              Here are some photos of both sides of the board for completeness. C28 is the cap that is measuring 500+ uF.

              I know that the only true test is measuring out of circuit but I cannot leave the fridge off all day.

              Would it be a good idea to buy the correct caps in and sit down one day and do a remove, test and replace? They are only cheap. I am very new to this please bear in mind. I am looking at CPC catalogue for 100V 2.2 uF cap and they have a Panasonic which is AM series. I wouldn't know if this is correct series for this board or do I just try and source identical caps of original design.

              Having read on this forum that Teapo are next to useless, what would I change them to?

              https://www.dropbox.com/s/v3zd5renss...26.09.jpg?dl=0

              https://www.dropbox.com/s/akrm1wwxnr...26.14.jpg?dl=0

              https://www.dropbox.com/s/1rtt5hsnp6...26.17.jpg?dl=0

              https://www.dropbox.com/s/1rtt5hsnp6...26.17.jpg?dl=0


              https://www.dropbox.com/s/djdk3cwy7b...26.43.jpg?dl=0

              https://www.dropbox.com/s/wzt51llb42...26.53.jpg?dl=0

              https://www.dropbox.com/s/gia7v94ujp...20HDR.jpg?dl=0

              https://www.dropbox.com/s/5uneztphce...20HDR.jpg?dl=0

              https://www.dropbox.com/s/26iriwefsq...20HDR.jpg?dl=0

              https://www.dropbox.com/s/na7lr7baaf...20HDR.jpg?dl=0
              Last edited by Rhothgar; 05-29-2015, 04:12 AM.

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                OFC it is obsolete, there are way better devices for that kind of money so I don't understand who can buy that. They are making it, what kind of argument it is? They have not inovated it for like 10 years maybe. It's like buying new Nokia 3310 for the price of Galaxy S6, if they were still making it.

                Use forum image hosting, there will be nothign within a month. I just went through a ton of images at some crap site which is eating my CPU so it is all lagging to learn most of them are not sharp and only small parts of the board so I see nothing in there.

                It seems the C28 filters Vcc for the Internatinoal Rectifier driving IC but I am not going again through those images there.
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                  #9
                  Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                  Originally posted by Behemot View Post
                  BTW I could have had sold you much better ESR meter for lower price. ESR70 is obsolete.
                  what are you selling?
                  and what happened to the russian guy with the dual-readout meter he was selling?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                    Behemot.

                    Not bought OFC. It is Peak Electronics. It is not obsolete. I think you mean it is older technology. What do you suggest? It is not helpful criticising someone who is new when I have little idea about electronics. It's simple and I believe suits my basic needs for testing caps. You are entitled to your POV.

                    Whatever your point is, it's not helpful.

                    Not sure what site you are referring to either. Perhaps you have posted on wrong thread?
                    Last edited by Rhothgar; 05-29-2015, 05:07 AM.

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                      #11
                      Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                      Originally posted by stj View Post
                      what are you selling?
                      and what happened to the russian guy with the dual-readout meter he was selling?
                      ESR Micro v4.0si. You mean Mikhail? I am authorised distributor now He's busy making them and overlooking business in Russia.
                      Originally posted by Rhothgar View Post
                      Not bought OFC. It is Peak Electronics. It is not obsolete. I think you mean it is older technology.
                      Obsolete is the very term for old, long outdated technology, so what is your problem?

                      It may be good for "basic" stuff but than it should cost 50 % of what they want for it. I mean they want 90 pounds for that? Really?!? I will most likely be selling ESR Micro v4.0si for around 90 US dollars on fleebay and it has 5times better range for ESR and 3times the capacitance plus it comes with relay protection and discharge circuit. Nothing else in this price range has anything like that.

                      And for over a double the price of ESR Micro (or 40 % more than Atlas) you can get Applent device which is totally different class. Measures 10 parameters incl. capacitance and ESR, much bigger ranges. Color touchscreen, internal memory for logging, USB interface.

                      I was refering to those images of yours. Better start again, take sharp focused images of the whole board and upload it HERE. Nobody is going to bother himself with those strage sites.

                      But I don't understand you can take loads of images but not desolder one capacitor? Could you explain? It takes 10 seconds.
                      Last edited by Behemot; 05-29-2015, 05:34 AM.
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                        #12
                        Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                        My point is I have come here for advice on capacitors not a discussion about the 'obsolete' meter I have bought.

                        Had you have read my introduction you would realise that I am new to this so let me ask you how could I possibly know whether the technology I have bought has been surpassed by newer more relevant technology?

                        I haven't a problem other than capacitors and a circuit board. Like I said, I didn't expect to join what looks to be a great forum to be greeted with a sales pitch and a welcome from you along the lines of 'how crap is your new meter?'

                        The soldering iron I have is not good. Perhaps I should have bought a Hakko instead of buying the ESR70. It may take you 10 seconds to desolder a capacitor but it would take me a lot longer.

                        I came here for basic advice (see post 1). I don't want to start desoldering capacitors if I do not have replacements immediately at hand as, as post 1 states, it is for a fridge (a working fridge which is currently minus its board whilst I seemingly have entered into an uncalled for argument about meters!).

                        https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9537
                        Last edited by Rhothgar; 05-29-2015, 05:37 AM.

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                          #13
                          Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                          What soldering iron you have? There is almost no copper on that board, you should be able to remove that single cap with pretty much anything. Just don't use torch

                          Well, not my problem, you bought old overpriced device…now you know you could have joined and asked before.
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                            #14
                            Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                            Never said it was your problem!

                            But I could easily return it and get a refund as I am within 14 days online change of mind period.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                              Thank think about it for sure. Is I said, for half the price, it would be nice device. But with such competition…they are maybe not even aware it exists And also dont forget all those chinese meters for 10 bucks (without cover) from fleebay. For really *basic* measurements (out of circuit), they can find some use too.

                              What about the solder iron?
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                                #16
                                Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                                ESR 4.0si looks too complex for me. With all the holes, I wouldn't know how to use it.

                                Soldering iron is currently 25W Antex. Crap!

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                                  It has leads but the DIP socket is usefull for removed caps. And it's all printed in there Capacitors on the right. The left part is just for calibration.

                                  Last edited by Behemot; 05-29-2015, 07:08 AM.
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                                    #18
                                    Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                                    How can I tell if a capacitor is DC or AC?

                                    I am heading off to electronics components supplier in a minute or so to buy some replacements but on their website there are capacitors for both!

                                    This is more complex than I first thought.

                                    What's a DIP?

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                                      #19
                                      Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                                      Most electrolytic caps are polarized ,they have labeled cathode (-), usually by white strip or something similar.

                                      Dual Inline Package, that socket is originally for DIP microchips.
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                                        #20
                                        Re: Hotpoint FFA47X Fridge Freezer

                                        Originally posted by Behemot View Post
                                        Most electrolytic caps are polarized ,they have labeled cathode (-), usually by white strip or something similar.
                                        Does that mean they are DC or AC when they have the white strip?

                                        Originally posted by Behemot View Post
                                        Dual Inline Package, that socket is originally for DIP microchips.
                                        That'll be the two lines of copper dots then on the top right of the meter!

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