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MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

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    #1

    MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

    MS-16P51 Ver 1.0 (no schematic, nor boardview)

    Hello, this board is not shorted to ground.
    One of the 4 coils above CPU (Vrms) is removed and a capacitor is missing t near (I can replace i).

    There is a short on the pad of this coil at the processor side. And I measured 0 Ohms and 0.7 Ohms at both sides of a capacitor on the back of CPU.
    I have another motherboard, exactly the same (with dead GPU and main power rail shorted to ground) and I have 0 and 2.5 Ohms on the sides of the same capacitor

    According your experience, dead CPU pls ?
    I'm not sure because this board is faulty after accidental short circuit with screwdriver somewhere on the board (battery not removed). And I don't think that could be kill a CPU.
    Tags: None
    #2
    Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

    what a coincidence !!
    I faced something similar to your case today
    hp probook 440 g3 power with black screen but after i open it and power it from the pins ; the laptop suddenly dead and 3.3v rail becomes shorted to the ground ; i inject 2v on 3.3v rail and the cpu becomes hot which is the cpu or chipset are dead .

    Comment

      #3
      Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

      Probably, I have a lot of dead motherboard with this issue.

      Comment

        #4
        Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

        Ok, thx for help

        Comment

          #5
          Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

          Lift all VCore coils, measured again. If you still get that 0.7 ohms the cpu is likely dead. But since you only have one capacitor reading short, I would remove the PCH and measure again, you may be lucky.
          Originally posted by PeteS in CA
          Remember that by the time consequences of a short-sighted decision are experienced, the idiot who made the bad decision may have already been promoted or moved on to a better job at another company.
          A working TV? How boring!

          Comment

            #6
            Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

            I measured lot of very very small capacitors directly soldered on PCH and all are shorted, but no short at coils of PCH. So, indeed, maybe PCH is dead.

            I guess you said « lucky » because replace PCH is a little bit easiest than CPU, and sure because temperatures are not so high than CPU ? But from my point of view, CPU or PCH dead are same. BGA soIder is my limit. I like diagnose, I don’t like SMD solder but I’m pretty good. But BGA soldering seems boring, heavy and not sure.

            Right now, I guess it's better not to touch them and sell them back to someone who has a good BGA machine. If I remove the PCH for diagnose, I could reduce the value of the board.

            But I have one MSI board (2017) with dead PCH, and maybe this one (2018). And I would like to see them work. I bought it 30 euro so maybe that could be a good idea to find someone who can replace PCH as a service, but I can’t find any price on the web.
            What would you do in my place pls ?

            Comment

              #7
              Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

              PCH is cheap and easy to replace on any rework station. Hell I can do them with a regular SMD hot air station and a small preheater underneath. CPU is very expensive and very fragile. I would order a PCH chip, look for someone with BGA rework equipment and get it replaced.
              Originally posted by PeteS in CA
              Remember that by the time consequences of a short-sighted decision are experienced, the idiot who made the bad decision may have already been promoted or moved on to a better job at another company.
              A working TV? How boring!

              Comment

                #8
                Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                I’m studing this option. I maybe found someone. He prefer reballing himself ths chips with lead balls. He said, it’s solid and safest for chip because temperatures are less than lead free. But, where can I find quality new chip not balled pls ?

                I have another question : on the MSI board, a coil is missing. Do you know where can I find the same pls ?

                (I add : sorry for the tittle, it is GE73 not GE72.
                Attached Files
                Last edited by corrize; 08-25-2021, 03:41 AM.

                Comment

                  #9
                  Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                  New chips always come with solder balls. Personally I stopped reballing new chips as the balls got smaller than 0.4mm because it is a pain in the ass, but indeed, leaded solder is much better in the long run. Too bad it doesn't prevent the stupid chips from failing short circuit on a HDMI or USB short, which seems to be the most common failure mode nowadays.

                  I personally buy from SEE-IC, other people may have different suppliers. Being sent a bad PCH is rare, you can just pick the cheapest supplier you can find.
                  Originally posted by PeteS in CA
                  Remember that by the time consequences of a short-sighted decision are experienced, the idiot who made the bad decision may have already been promoted or moved on to a better job at another company.
                  A working TV? How boring!

                  Comment

                    #10
                    Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                    Good ! I will test with chipset.

                    There is supplier for leaded balled chips ? I can’t find one, even in low prices.

                    I saw a french Ytb video last week, micro soldering shop said they (with other shops) noticed chipsets issues increasing for (gaming and other) >2017 laptops. He assumed the cause is there is no heatsink on chipsets nowadays.

                    I personnaly noticed on the other MSI with dead chipset, there is 2 big caps discolored close the nvme drive. And the seller said the previous nvme drive has destroyed and replaced. Maybe these « new » fast nvme add big load on chipset ? And chipsets need better cooled ? I don’t measured the temperature, but I will try to do (when it will be fixed).

                    Comment

                      #11
                      Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                      No heatsink is one issue, also the smaller manufacturing process means they are more sensitive to shocks, so ports to the outside world require better protection. Which is not fitted. Hence why they go kaboom.

                      I had an old C2D Acer which had 220V go on the data lines of one USB port. All the USBs were dead and the Southbridge was running hot, but everything else still worked, it still booted and could connect to wifi. Replacing the Southbridge got the board fully functional of course.
                      Originally posted by PeteS in CA
                      Remember that by the time consequences of a short-sighted decision are experienced, the idiot who made the bad decision may have already been promoted or moved on to a better job at another company.
                      A working TV? How boring!

                      Comment

                        #12
                        Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                        Starting from 8-series chipset (coupled with Haswell/4th gen CPU) I personally found the failure rate to have increased significantly (for the PCH but for the CPU as well). So it's more since 2013 than 2017. Of course they didn't all fail right away and people didn't pay too much attention to it at first, so the problem has been more noticeable since 2016 or so.

                        In most situation the PCH does not require a heatsink (it doesn't dissipate that much power), and some designs didn't use it even on older PCH (7-series in particular, but some 5-series and 6-series can sometimes be found without heatsink) so I don't believe it is primarily heat-related.
                        OpenBoardView — https://github.com/OpenBoardView/OpenBoardView

                        Comment

                          #13
                          Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                          Some nvme drives need coolers. The traffic cross the chipset, so I can't understand why the nvme need coolers and not the chipset ?

                          Originally posted by Th3_uN1Qu3 View Post
                          Lift all VCore coils, measured again. If you still get that 0.7 ohms the cpu is likely dead. But since you only have one capacitor reading short, I would remove the PCH and measure again, you may be lucky.
                          I taked off 3 shorted to ground coils and the 3 short keep present at the pads at CPU side. But, on the CPU plate, there is no capacitor for measuring (I7-8750H), there is only solder control points and none is shorted to ground. And on the chipset plate, there is lot of caps and all are shorted to ground, even a big cap at the side.

                          So CPU or chipset ?...

                          I don't want to remove the chipset to check, because if it is good, I should pay for replace chispet and CPU. What's left ? Current injection ?

                          Comment

                            #14
                            Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                            Hello, update : I’m lucky : with voltage injection, I found a hot spot ont PCH. And I found someone with BGA Rework station for replace it.
                            I have 2 boads with deads PCH.

                            I will order new chips. But I saw that a chipset could have differents references. How do you know it is exactly the same pls ?

                            Comment

                              #15
                              Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                              sSpec number
                              OpenBoardView — https://github.com/OpenBoardView/OpenBoardView

                              Comment

                                #16
                                Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                                Originally posted by corrize View Post
                                I will order new chips. But I saw that a chipset could have differents references. How do you know it is exactly the same pls ?
                                They are laser marked. Starts with SR or SL with those usually. It can be faint but they are always marked. Sometimes you have to peel a black useless sticker from all around the core to expose it.

                                Comment

                                  #17
                                  Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                                  Hello,
                                  update : I sent 2 MSI motherboards with chipset to replace, to someone who has a BGA station. He s not a professional. We have 2 problems :
                                  - The BGA station is : T862-IRDA, and he scared that is not enought for lead free chipset for gamer MB. Usualy, he solder BGA for Apple stuffs. True ?
                                  Possible to use it with hot air and check with multimeter thermometer probe ?
                                  - He don’t like leaded balls chips, he prefer reballing with lead solder. And we are searching stencils for chipsets : SR40B and SR30W. Do you know where I can find that pls ? And quality ones ?
                                  Thx

                                  Comment

                                    #18
                                    Re: MSI GE72 8RE – CPU dead ?

                                    T862 is not enough for anything, it's a scam, no idea how he could manage to solder any large BGAs on any board. (small BGAs are done with hot air, not this garbage) For large BGA you need a proper BGA rework station or you're 100% sure to destroy the board and the chip.
                                    OpenBoardView — https://github.com/OpenBoardView/OpenBoardView

                                    Comment

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