ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

[DynaxSC]

Hi all

I have a non-working ZOTAC GTX1070 card with 8GB RAM. No Video output, PC crashes immediately after Windows loads the NVIDIA driver and card is shown correctly identified in Device Manager. Another motherboard didn't even manage to start booting Windows and was stuck on VGA check.

I have tested the the whole RAM of the card with MATS, and it shows 100% read errors on all chips, but no write errors (picture attached).

Also one memory chip I had to solder on the card, because it was missing, so at least this one memory chip must be working (Micron D9TCB).

It can't believe that all memory chips are broken the same way including the new one. Can anybody say what this means, is it a corrupt memory controller in the GPU, or is it possible that one common line eg. an write enable for all chips is broken somewhere between the GPU chip and the memory chips ?

Does it make sense to reball the GPU and solder back on the board, or must the GPU be replaced ?

Thanks in advance for any hint.

[WayOfTheRoad]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Hello. Is this the normal Zotac 1070 or AMP Edition? We may be able to help each other.

As for your photo/returns, that usually indicates a bad controller or a bad setup of MATS itself. Are you sure you have the correct settings?

[DynaxSC]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Hi,

regarding Mods/Mats I believe that the configuration is OK, as another working GTX1070 is passign all the tests w/o a problem.
I have tested the card both with versions 367.38.1, 400.184 with following commands (as second card, IGPU is first):


1. ./mods gputest.js -skip_rm_state_init -mfg
2. ./mats -n 1 -e 20 |less

The reports are attached, but v400 does not go at all.

I have asked also about it on another local polish forum, and the conclusion there is that the most probably memory controller of the GPU is corrupt due to the low resistances measured.
BTW, the GPU resistance seems to be very low, but it is measured with a very precise low resistance unit working with 4 cables, so it is able to correct the cable resistance problem when measuring very low resistances. This resistance seems to be OK, beacuse I usually get such resistances on GP104-200-A1 GPU's (usually 0.13 R, sometime up to 0,2 R if luck in silicon lottery - I observed that these chips with higher resistance are usually better to overclock and consume less power). I have attached a picture of the board with resistance measurements.

I have also another Gigabyte GTX1070 card with exactly same problem. Only the detailled report data is different, but also read errors on all chips. On this another card I also testwise desoldered all the DDR5 chips, and tested the card again, the result is completely the same as if with DDR5 chips were on the card.

Pls let me know what do you think ?

BTW do you maybe know what resistance a single desordered DDR5 chip shoud have on power supply (1,5V). I measured a few desoldered ones, and get ca 120 kohms , on different chips which I marked bad (don't remeber why), I measured 20-70 ohms ? I look for a way how to check the DDR5 chips one by one ?

Regards

[WayOfTheRoad]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Hello and good to hear back! As I mentioned, you may be able to help me as well so I'll add info for you and then maybe you can ID two components in the photo (red and green arrow, red a resistor and green a 3-leg transistor).

Anyway, some info for you

So, all measurements are fine except GPU, RAM and PEX. I marked with "X" in the photo which are bad.

A 10-series GPU should have a resistance of about 1ohm, in my experience.

The Micron GDDR5 should have about 60-90ohm. Samsung is usually about 30-45ohm. Anything higher or lower is usually bad +/- 5%.

The PEX rail should be about 90ohm. 60 is not necessarily bad but should be considered a potential failure. Anything below 50ohm on PEX is a definite problem.


As for measurements, I've added an area for you to check in diode mode on the PCIE slot. Measure the first 10 pins (those I circled). These lead straight to GPU/PEX and often denote a bad GPU memory controller (which I believe is the problem). Red probe on ground, black probe on pins, Your measurements should be something like this:

OL , GROUND , .460+ , .460+ , GROUND, OL , GROUND , .460+ , .460+ , GROUND


ground will show as .000-.002 volts.


Let me know what you get back as I think your issue is a bad GPU memory controller but there is a small chance you just have a bad PEX rail.

The other card you mentioned it 99% the GPU memory controller being bad. If all RAM removed gives same result it's the GPU, sadly.





On helping me, could you give me a resistance measurement of the resistor marked with the red arrow and photo or label of what is on the 3-leg transistor marked with the green arrow? I just need to know what numbers/letters are printed on it.

Thanks, good luck and let me know!

[DynaxSC]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Hi,

Regarding the componets:

1. The resistor is a 10kohm resistor, I measured it in circuit in both directions, and it shows the same, so should be the correct value

2. The transistor has the marking "C", i have desoldered it and tested with a nice device, it shows it is a N-E-MOSFET, pls find attached two pictures from the test. The cables are 1 - blue, 2 - yellow and 3 green (probably, as I am slightly color blind, nethertheless the last one). You can see the transistor on the picture clamped with pins down as on the PCB, on one side blue (the side with the single pin), and on the other side yellow and green.

I hope this will help you. Let me know should you need more help.

Regarding the CPU from the card I have just desoldered it, before reading your answer, and after desoldering I have the following readings on the card:
RAM_FBVDD 42,7 ohm
PEX_16,6 kohm
Rest did not change

So it looks like the RAM's are definitely broken, at least some another ones of them.

I have also measured some supply's on the desoldered GPU and it shows the following:

Pin / Resistance / Diode mode measurement
FBVDD / 172 ohm / 0,0625V
PEX / 74 ohm / 0,0268V
1,8VAON / 38,1 kohm / 0,539V
1,8V / 240 kohm / does not measure

I'd appreciate if you could verify if these GPU measurings are OK.
I have also another GPU desordered, and there is the difference, that 1,8VAON and 1,8V have only 2-4 ohms resistance, and now I'm not sure what is correct.

BTW, the 0,13 ohm on NNVDD is in my opinion correct, as I measure with a very precise instrument, which does not measure the measuring cable resistance. If I use a simple ohm meter, I get something about 0,4 ohms but this is incorrect measuring, as this includes also cable resistance, which is very meaningful with such low resistances. I have seen already a lot of this GPU's (GP104-200-A1) with 0,13-0,2 ohms working good.


The RAM I will desolder all of them and check one by one. If you could tell me which resistance they should show on FBVDD. I measured some I have desoldered before, and they have usually about 120kohms, some I had with 20-40 ohm, but they are probably bad.

Thanks a lot for your help. I will follow up with your hints during the weekend.

[WayOfTheRoad]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Hello again and THANK YOU for the detailed help! Truly! It helps a lot so thank you!

I will verify the readings and get back to you as soon as I can (no more than a day or so).

Those changes in measurement are interesting and do suggest the issue may be just a massive failure of the RAM. CPU maybe still good? Let us find out!

I'll try to find my old scrap/parts 1070 to get down to the deeper measurements to help but I'll first verify those above on a good card and report back.

Thanks again and glad to offer any help I can to someone like you that helped me! I'll report back soon.

[DynaxSC]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

OK. Thanks for reply, pls note I have edited my previous post with some additional information. BTW, should you need a Gigabyte GTX 1070 boardview, I can send you one, just give me your pm.

[WayOfTheRoad]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

OK. Thanks for reply, pls note I have edited my previous post with some additional information. BTW, should you need a Gigabyte GTX 1070 boardview, I can send you one, just give me your pm.

Yes, I use a basic Fluke so if you have very precise measurement tools I'd say it's entirely possible the resistance of the chip *is* good. I consider 1ohm but I do have to account for my instruments likely not being as precise as yours. I agree with you there.

Also, based on the new measurements after you removed the CPU itself, it does seen possible that it is good and it was a rare case of massive RAM failures!


Yeah, a boardview of that card would be great. Just click my name and choose to send a private message. I think that should work.

[SMDFlea]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

OK. Thanks for reply, pls note I have edited my previous post with some additional information. BTW, should you need a Gigabyte GTX 1070 boardview, I can send you one, just give me your pm.

post it on the forum for everyone

[DynaxSC]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Hi, I just removed one RAM, and only the one I have soldered in the beginnig on the card in the missing place. I turns out, that just this spare RAM is broken, as the resistance after desoldering went high over 260 ohms. It seems I assumed my spare RAM is good, but it was not. How stupid one must be not to check this before soldering the part on the card, and then desoldering also the GPU. Lessons learned.
However I need still to reball and resolder the GPU back on the card. Probably during the weekend. I'm very curious what will be the result.

I also suspect, that my Mods/Mats image is still somewhat wrong. I have read on some russian site, that people had similar problems with the image and did correct something. But I do not have time now to make a dissertation on Linux. I will just try the easy way, and if it will not work, then I will try to see how to get this corrected image from the russian site - probably I must register there, but my Russian is no good.

[WayOfTheRoad]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

I forgot to mention the MATS logs from before so I'm glad you mentioned them again.

It does seem that there is likely an issue with your MATS/MODS settings. If you like, I'll make an image of what I use and post a link just to be safe. It's just the memory test but it definitely works. I've mostly just used it over the full MATS/MODS features lately. I found I don't use the other programs and just swap my image based on whether I'm testing 20MB or 1024.

As for the RAM and assuming it's good, it happens to the best of us (lol). Really. I've done the same with any number of parts when I'm ultra-focused and wanting to get a job done. This month alone I wasted two PS4 Southbridge chips by not replacing the bad 5v PMIC I knew was bad first, lol. I felt like an idiot (I am sometimes) but I was just in a hurry. I'd have actually laughed if it didn't cost me money. That part sucks.

Measurements coming soon!

[RethoricalCheese]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Just letting you know that having no display output is not a problem with mats. You can just modify the files a bit so it would do everything automatically and shut down the machine when it's finished. This lets you know that it finished testing. Then using another computer just check the report file.

I even added a beep (you know, from the little speaker on motherboard) in autoexec.bat file to let me know if it has started booting to linux. ./mats -e 10 and poweroff commands go to a file named commands.

Just keep monitor plugged into the GPU, not iGPU.

[WayOfTheRoad]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Just letting you know that having no display output is not a problem with mats. You can just modify the files a bit so it would do everything automatically and shut down the machine when it's finished. This lets you know that it finished testing. Then using another computer just check the report file.

I even added a beep (you know, from the little speaker on motherboard) in autoexec.bat file to let me know if it has started booting to linux. ./mats -e 10 and poweroff commands go to a file named commands.

Just keep monitor plugged into the GPU, not iGPU.

Exactly right and I'm uploading an image he can download as I type this. Just the memory test, auto shutdown. 20MB.

I actually don't even use the other apps available in MODS/MATS or mess with the command it offers. I like it but just don't use more than the memory test.

[DynaxSC]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Perfect, many thanks for the upload, this will allow me to exclude a potential point of failure hopefully.

[RethoricalCheese]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

I found one image which even bypassed dos. So it booted straight into tinylinux. But it lacked newer mats/mods version. I will merge them together soon and this would make the cleanest, fastest test.

[WayOfTheRoad]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

I found one image which even bypassed dos. So it booted straight into tinylinux. But it lacked newer mats/mods version. I will merge them together soon and this would make the cleanest, fastest test.

Yes, this is also what I do. It automatically umps straight to the test and shuts off when done. I usually leave it at 20MB test but with a 980ti I had to go to 1024. I just saved an image of it and share it across devices as I need it. A bit big at about 2GB but that's the minimum size drive you'd want to use anyway (or so I was told).

Yet, I'm still basing it on 400.184 , is this the latest version? If you have a newer one I'd love to give it a try

[RethoricalCheese]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

I guess that the latest.

[WayOfTheRoad]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

I guess that the latest.

Oh, ok. I wasn't sure if another had been leaked or made available. Thanks.

[DynaxSC]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Hi Folks

I exchanged the borken RAM, reballed and resolderred the GPU on the card, and voila, the card works again. I assembled it back toghether and do a load test now with Furmark, but it seams everything is OK for now.

So this means, the guy who sold the card was not lying, it was only the one RAM, but I was too stupid to make it right . But It's really difficult to trust these sellers, as they usually do not tell the whole trough, ar even lie, but this time I had luck.

This also means my Mods/Mats image does work correctly only if the card is OK, when RAM is broken it does not do its job and shows rubbish.


If you could tell me where I can downlod the images you wrote about, I'd appreciate that. I'm not and linux expert at all.

Cezary

[WayOfTheRoad]

Re: ZOTAC GTX1070 8GB - Read Errors on all DDR5 chips

Hi Folks

I exchanged the borken RAM, reballed and resolderred the GPU on the card, and voila, the card works again. I assembled it back toghether and do a load test now with Furmark, but it seams everything is OK for now.

So this means, the guy who sold the card was not lying, it was only the one RAM, but I was too stupid to make it right . But It's really difficult to trust these sellers, as they usually do not tell the whole trough, ar even lie, but this time I had luck.

This also means my Mods/Mats image does work correctly only if the card is OK, when RAM is broken it does not do its job and shows rubbish.


If you could tell me where I can downlod the images you wrote about, I'd appreciate that. I'm not and linux expert at all.

Cezary

Awesome!
Great news!


Did you get my last from about 4 days back? I linked it there. It's titled MATS/MODS.