Badcaps.net Forum
Go Back   Badcaps Forums > General Topics > General Computer & Tech Discussion
Register FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-15-2018, 10:25 AM   #1
canadaboy25
I hate waiting!
 
canadaboy25's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
City & State: Saskatchewan
My Country: Canada
Line Voltage: 120VAC 60Hz
I'm a: Hobbyist Tech
Posts: 422
Default Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Hey guys, not sure whether to put this in computer discussion or networking but I think it fits here best.

I have an old Konica Minolta 2430dl color printer that is super old but still works really well. It has very high capacity toner drums which is really nice. It used to connect to the network but it got hit by lightning and blew the ethernet card out of it. Since then (at least 6 years ago) I've been using it in conjunction with a USR5461 router with a usb print host which works well. Up until Windows 10 updated.

It now prints pages too far up or too far down on the paper so that some of the image is cropped off and sometimes even twists the image so that it looks like it's sliding off the page. However, sometimes it will print perfect. It doesn't seem to matter what program or print settings I use.

When I originally set it up with Windows 10 I couldn't get it connecting at all. I'd go through the TCP/IP setup wizards but it would never connect. Finally I just gave up. After not touching it for months I ended up accidentally sending a print job to it and it printed just fine. So basically I have no idea how I ever got it working the first time.

Now since Windows has butchered my OS with their new update, one of the issues was all my printers were deleted. I went through the TCP/IP wizards and couldn't get it to work. I ended up not choosing the TCP/IP option and just typing the address into the "printer name" networked printer option in the add printer wizard which allowed me to print but with these strange intermittent issues.

I did some searching and some results said the issue might have something to do with the internet port being used to print on my computer. I think this might be the right path because now when I go to printers-my_printer-printer properties-ports, it shows up as using an "internet port" instead of the previous TPC/IP port. However, I have no idea what any of this means.

Hopefully someone has some ideas. Thanks
__________________
canadaboy25

-Sometimes the light at the end of a tunnel is an on-coming train
canadaboy25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2018, 11:21 AM   #2
stj
Great Sage 齊天大聖
 
stj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
City & State: Europe
My Country: some shithole run by Israeli agents
I'm a: Professional Tech
Posts: 24,574
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

you answered your own question, win10 has fucked drivers.
to prove it, run a linux live-disk or a laptop with Linux, xp or 7 on it.

btw, you should look at the internal ethernet board.
it may be a simple fix - just replacing the controller chip.

Last edited by stj; 09-15-2018 at 11:22 AM..
stj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2018, 02:19 PM   #3
canadaboy25
I hate waiting!
 
canadaboy25's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
City & State: Saskatchewan
My Country: Canada
Line Voltage: 120VAC 60Hz
I'm a: Hobbyist Tech
Posts: 422
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Quote:
Originally Posted by stj View Post
you answered your own question, win10 has fucked drivers.
to prove it, run a linux live-disk or a laptop with Linux, xp or 7 on it.

btw, you should look at the internal ethernet board.
it may be a simple fix - just replacing the controller chip.
I'm aware you don't like Windows 10 but I've explained why some old ass OS like XP or something like Linux won't work for me. Also, I'm using the same Konica driver I've always used.

And there's nothing to prove by running a live boot disk. I know it isn't the printer's fault. It's the computer.

I was wondering if anyone had any ideas on what to change in software to get it working or how to somehow get it configured on a TCP/IP port again.

I've looked at repairing the network on the printer but everything is integrated on one board so there's no just replacing the network card.
canadaboy25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2018, 02:26 PM   #4
goontron
5000!
 
goontron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
City & State: South Greeley, Wyoming
My Country: US
Line Voltage: 13.9kv HT service and some 240v center tap oddity.
I'm a: Professional Tech
Posts: 4,029
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

^ printer drivers for old printers have been fucked for ages on Windows. My hp laserjet 2100 hasn't worked since 8.
__________________
Things I've fixed: anything from semis to crappy Chinese $2 radios, and now an IoT Dildo....

"Dude, this is Wyoming, i hopped on and sent 'er. No fucking around." -- Me

Excuse me while i do something dangerous


You must have a sad, sad boring life if you hate on people harmlessly enjoying life with an animal costume.

Sometimes you need to break shit to fix it.... Thats why my lawnmower doesn't have a deadman switch or engine brake anymore

Tomorrow Is Nearly Yesterday And Everyday Is Stupid!
goontron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2018, 02:30 PM   #5
canadaboy25
I hate waiting!
 
canadaboy25's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
City & State: Saskatchewan
My Country: Canada
Line Voltage: 120VAC 60Hz
I'm a: Hobbyist Tech
Posts: 422
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

How does that explain it going from working to not being able to reinstall?

"The drivers are fucked" isn't very descriptive
canadaboy25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2018, 03:32 PM   #6
goontron
5000!
 
goontron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
City & State: South Greeley, Wyoming
My Country: US
Line Voltage: 13.9kv HT service and some 240v center tap oddity.
I'm a: Professional Tech
Posts: 4,029
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

^ You can't make it work correctly on 10 unless you go back before the update that broke it... You can try reinstalling the driver, but not much else can be tried.

Last edited by goontron; 09-15-2018 at 03:38 PM..
goontron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2018, 05:23 PM   #7
Curious.George
Badcaps Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,301
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Quote:
Originally Posted by stj View Post
you answered your own question, win10 has fucked drivers.
to prove it, run a linux live-disk or a laptop with Linux, xp or 7 on it.
Exactly.

"When I originally set it up with Windows 10 I couldn't get it connecting at all..."

"I have no idea how I ever got it working the first time.."

"Windows has butchered my OS with their new update..."

Quote:
I'm aware you don't like Windows 10 but I've explained why some old ass OS like XP or something like Linux won't work for me. Also, I'm using the same Konica driver I've always used.
For the same reason that you can no longer run WfWG apps. Or, screen savers from W98. Or...

Printers are disposable items as far as the OS is concerned. And, the printer manufacturers have very little incentive to keep updating drivers for OLDER printers -- then you wouldn't buy a NEWER replacement!

If you find a fix for your current problem, you'll bitch, later, when some other update munges things. Or, YOUR move to Windows 11 leaves your printer behind.

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!" (i.e., leave a PC set up with your printer and talk to that PC from your "new" printer)

If you want to keep chasing the latest Windows release, then be prepared to chase the newest HARDWARE releases as well. Drivers for older devices tend not to get updated, as a rule. Moving to the newer OS indicates your acceptance of this fact!

Having said all that, try going through the motions from a different W10 PC with the same W10 patch level (Windows never seems to completely "forget" a previously installed device, even if you "remove" that device!).

I always print using Industry Standard (not to be confused with MS's standard of the month!) protocols figuring the printers WILL observe them and MS might implement them properly. For me, that means TCP/IP port 9100 and "Raw".

Consider getting a tiny/old PC/laptop of USFF and installing Windows (XP/7) on it JUST to host your printers and other legacy devices. Put it on your network and HOPE MS will continue to talk to its older OS's (with minimal contortions)
Curious.George is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2018, 07:06 PM   #8
R_J
Badcaps Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
City & State: ☻
My Country: Canada
I'm a: Professional Tech
Posts: 7,103
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

when you went to Add Printer, did you choose "add a printer using TCP/IP address or host name " or did you choose "add a local printer or network printer with manual settings"
Use the add a local printer, then create a new port, standard TCP/IP port and enter the printers ip address, see if that helps

Last edited by R_J; 09-15-2018 at 07:11 PM..
R_J is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 12:06 AM   #9
canadaboy25
I hate waiting!
 
canadaboy25's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
City & State: Saskatchewan
My Country: Canada
Line Voltage: 120VAC 60Hz
I'm a: Hobbyist Tech
Posts: 422
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Quote:
Originally Posted by R_J View Post
when you went to Add Printer, did you choose "add a printer using TCP/IP address or host name " or did you choose "add a local printer or network printer with manual settings"
Use the add a local printer, then create a new port, standard TCP/IP port and enter the printers ip address, see if that helps
Thank you for the first reasonable response to my question. I will take a look at that and get back to you.



I'm tired of how hypocritical some of the members here are. "Oh lets bash this guy for not wanting to pitch his working printer in the trash because it's not the latest and greatest hardware - meanwhile bitching about modern operating systems and using shit like XP. Linux is worthless shit for any sort of software specialization and even Windows 7 won't run some of the programs I need.

This is supposed to be a community but some people just feel personally attacked the second someone mentions Windows 10.

It's obviously not just "printer drivers are fucked for Windows 10" if that was the case I wouldn't be able to print flawlessly when connected to the same fucking printer with a usb cable directly. It's clearly a networking issue which I thought I could get some advice on but clearly that's unrealistic because you all just want to turn it into a pissing war over which OS is better.

And saying I'm "bitching" about my problem is so hypocritical that it hurts. Iv'e been reading posts about you all pissing and moaning about 10 "spying" and other shit for YEARS.

It's not an amazing OS, I'm not trying to say it is, but if I adopted your mindset of "if it doesn't work right away it must be fucked so throw it out and buy a new one", I'd be broke.

I guess I'll just hook it up to my PC with the usb cable and transfer every file that needs printed from other devices to this PC. Really quite disgusted at the attitudes I've received in response to my question that was aimed at solving a problem and helping me learn something.

BTW what in the fuck does this mean? ""If it ain't broke, don't fix it!" (i.e., leave a PC set up with your printer and talk to that PC from your "new" printer)"????????? Leave my printer set up with my PC and talk to it with my new printer? Why the hell would I talk to my old printer, or even have it for that matter, if I had a new printer?
canadaboy25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 12:16 AM   #10
canadaboy25
I hate waiting!
 
canadaboy25's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
City & State: Saskatchewan
My Country: Canada
Line Voltage: 120VAC 60Hz
I'm a: Hobbyist Tech
Posts: 422
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Quote:
Originally Posted by R_J View Post
when you went to Add Printer, did you choose "add a printer using TCP/IP address or host name " or did you choose "add a local printer or network printer with manual settings"
Use the add a local printer, then create a new port, standard TCP/IP port and enter the printers ip address, see if that helps
To get it to work at all I put the address in the "Select a shared printer by name" box and then selected the driver. I've tried what you suggested and all combinations of it with no avail. Interestingly, choosing manual settings then TCP/IP brings me to the same page as though I just chose TCP/IP originally.

Thanks for the reply.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Printer Setup.JPG (40.0 KB, 4 views)
canadaboy25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 03:11 AM   #11
Curious.George
Badcaps Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,301
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Quote:
Originally Posted by canadaboy25 View Post
I'm tired of how hypocritical some of the members here are. "Oh lets bash this guy for not wanting to pitch his working printer in the trash because it's not the latest and greatest hardware - meanwhile bitching about modern operating systems and using shit like XP.
Just because you don't like the facts, doesn't change the reality!

I've got a $25,000 emulator that won't work with new OS's because they don't give the software access to the machine (hardware) at a low enough level -- and the manufacturer has no desire to write a new version of the software just to save me the expense of buying A NEW EMULATOR!

So, I run these devices off OLD machines with old OS's -- because newer machines often won't run those OS's (lack of driver support). To "talk to" the machine, I either run a network protocol or something as inelegant as VNC.

The same sort of problems pertain to my $15,000 EPROM programmer and another $10,000 ICE.

Quote:
Linux is worthless shit for any sort of software specialization and even Windows 7 won't run some of the programs I need.
Then DON'T RUN LINUX! But, the world doesn't consist of two OS's -- Linux and W10. I have machines, here, running everything from DOS 3.31 (ISA based to support the $4,000 coprocessor stuffed inside it) to 95/98, XP, Vista, and 7. Then, there are the Solaris hosts and the NetBSD hosts. But, no 10. And no Linux.

And, I can talk to each of them from the comfort of a single workstation (though the ISA box has a parallel port network adapter so it is dog slow)

Quote:
This is supposed to be a community but some people just feel personally attacked the second someone mentions Windows 10.
No, they're telling you The Facts of Life. Ask the same question (about your orphaned printer -- or, my orphaned emulator) when W2K came out and you'd get a similar response.

Quote:
BTW what in the fuck does this mean? ""If it ain't broke, don't fix it!" (i.e., leave a PC set up with your printer and talk to that PC from your "new" printer)"????????? Leave my printer set up with my PC and talk to it with my new printer? Why the hell would I talk to my old printer, or even have it for that matter, if I had a new printer?
It's obviously a typographical error -- as would be obvious to anyone whose eyes weren't clogged with fecal matter for having their head up their *ss.

Here, wipe the crap out of your eyes and try again:
Quote:
If it ain't broke, don't fix it!" (i.e., leave a PC set up with your printer and talk to that PC from your "new" PC/OS)"
Ditto that old scanner that is no longer supported. Or that old coprocessor. Or emulator. Or EPROM programmer. Or... Sooner or later, you're going to find yourself with a device that ISN'T supported and you'll face a decision:
  • discard the device in favor of the newer OS (buy a replacement for the device);
  • avoid the upgrade (to continue to use the old device); or
  • find a way to continue supporting the device AND upgrading

(If you don't have $10 to buy a spare OLD laptop/USFF box, maybe you should get a job that pays better? I keep a dozen such devices on hand as they are simply too inexpensive not to make use of! Lately, repurposing $10 t610 thin clients for that role)

https://support.hp.com/us-en/product...client/5226816

Last edited by Curious.George; 09-16-2018 at 03:23 AM..
Curious.George is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 04:57 AM   #12
stj
Great Sage 齊天大聖
 
stj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
City & State: Europe
My Country: some shithole run by Israeli agents
I'm a: Professional Tech
Posts: 24,574
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

use a raspberry pi as a network print server, if you can bring yourself to use Linux.
stj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 08:59 AM   #13
goontron
5000!
 
goontron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
City & State: South Greeley, Wyoming
My Country: US
Line Voltage: 13.9kv HT service and some 240v center tap oddity.
I'm a: Professional Tech
Posts: 4,029
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curious.George View Post
Just because you don't like the facts, doesn't change the reality!

I've got a $25,000 emulator that won't work with new OS's because they don't give the software access to the machine (hardware) at a low enough level -- and the manufacturer has no desire to write a new version of the software just to save me the expense of buying A NEW EMULATOR!
Let me guess... An IBM mainframe emulator?


Yes, im derailling this thread. OP obviously doesn't like the answer of "Win 10 has changed and that driver has broken thanks to it" from people who work in the field on this broken nonsence. (tell me not, every update something else breaks. no?) So might as well.

Last edited by goontron; 09-16-2018 at 09:03 AM..
goontron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 09:26 AM   #14
jetadm123
Badcaps Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
City & State: California
Posts: 2,169
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

It wouldn't be the first time a software update was used to "fix" one thing, but broke something else. With that being said:

1) Is there any way to remove that software update?

2) Not sure about Windows 10, but on some of the older versions of Windows, there was a "system restore" function where you could select a date prior to the update and it would restore the system to the date you selected.
jetadm123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 12:09 PM   #15
R_J
Badcaps Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
City & State: ☻
My Country: Canada
I'm a: Professional Tech
Posts: 7,103
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

The drive I have windows 10 on quit yesterday (seagate 160G) but I have it working today
Choose add a local printer, create a new port (standard TCP/IP Port), enter the printers ip address, It should detect the printers ip address, then proceed to picking the driver.
I am using an old Laserjet 4 without a problem
Attached Images
File Type: jpg addPrinter.jpg (45.8 KB, 6 views)
File Type: jpg addPrinter2.jpg (34.2 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg addPrinter3.jpg (35.9 KB, 6 views)
File Type: jpg addPrinter4.jpg (27.7 KB, 5 views)

Last edited by R_J; 09-16-2018 at 12:12 PM..
R_J is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 12:25 PM   #16
canadaboy25
I hate waiting!
 
canadaboy25's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
City & State: Saskatchewan
My Country: Canada
Line Voltage: 120VAC 60Hz
I'm a: Hobbyist Tech
Posts: 422
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Quote:
Originally Posted by R_J View Post
The drive I have windows 10 on quit yesterday (seagate 160G) but I have it working today
Choose add a local printer, create a new port (standard TCP/IP Port), enter the printers ip address, It should detect the printers ip address, then proceed to picking the driver.
I am using an old Laserjet 4 without a problem
Those are the steps I've been following. However, it never seems to communicate to the printer because almost immediately it brings me to the "Additional port information required" page. Selecting custom brings up the "configure standard TCP/IP port monitor" page with the setting shown. Clicking ok and next lets me choose the driver but trying to print a test page results in nothing.

I must be going wrong with the port monitor settings I assume

Thanks for the help.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg addprinter.JPG (38.6 KB, 8 views)
File Type: jpg addprinter2.JPG (47.8 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg addprinter3.JPG (45.3 KB, 8 views)
File Type: jpg addprinter4.JPG (49.2 KB, 5 views)
canadaboy25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 12:31 PM   #17
Curious.George
Badcaps Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,301
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Quote:
Originally Posted by goontron View Post
Let me guess... An IBM mainframe emulator?
Actually, no -- an "In-Circuit Emulator". Plugs into the CPU socket of boards I've designed and lets me exercise the hardware/software from "inside" the processor. Different board sets and pods for different processors.

Quote:
Yes, im derailling this thread. OP obviously doesn't like the answer of "Win 10 has changed and that driver has broken thanks to it" from people who work in the field on this broken nonsence. (tell me not, every update something else breaks. no?) So might as well.
My solution to the endless updates problem has been to avoid an OS until MS considers it EOL. Then, grab ALL the updates and apply them BEFORE installing any hardware/software. Evaluate which of your peripherals/software are no longer supported and decide whether its worth the effort to reinstall everything (new licenses, etc.) on the new OS.
"What does this new OS buy me that I can't do with the old one? What yet-to-be-discovered bugs are present vs. those that I've already found workarounds for in the old OS?"
OP is frustrated and wants things to be "as they were". I wasn't keen on losing the ability to access any of my emulators (the $10K unit only works on one special type of CPU), the EPROM programmer, my first "B-size" scanner (or the A size w/ADF), my MO disk drives, the coprocessor that ran my PCB layout software, etc.

And, we're not even talking about all of the SOFTWARE that "no longer runs" (or, no longer runs PROPERLY).

But, I didn't whine about it -- I sorted out what was important to me and figured out how to keep what I needed (which is always less than what you WANTED) and accept the losses for those things that I couldn't afford to keep (as opposed to affording to LOSE)!

[I sorely miss my AD screen savers!!]

It just makes no sense to not have "other machines" lying around if you want to keep old software/hardware accessible. Even my oldest PC ("Compaq Portable 386") can talk to the network -- and, thus, ME at another workstation.

I have Neoware CA10's scattered around to connect to various devices that require, e.g., SCSI HBA's -- so I can access that SCSI peripheral from ANY workstation and even from another room! You don't have to put a keyboard and monitor on each box; just attach the I/Os that are important and "remote" the user interface.

At the very least, it lets you do a clean install and check to see if something ELSE might be the problem!

Or, whine (about a few hundred dollars worth of printer ).

[Personally, I discarded most of my printers -- color duplexed phaser, color laser, widebody color inkjet, duplexed mono laser -- and just settled on a pair of low-throughput LJ's with low temperature toner. Much more economical to run (for infrequent printing). And, saves me the hassle of maintaining those other printers for their occasional use. Walk to the Kinkos down the street when I need anything printed in color or in quantity -- maybe twice a year? Live without it for the rest of the time (preview on large monitor rotated to portrait mode). Pay someone else to ensure the printer is ready when I want/need it!]

I suspect the OP can eventually get his printer working. But, by starting clean and taking copious notes along the way. Not just "poking at it" and hoping for the best... (I keep a build log on each machine indicating what drivers were installed, apps, patches, version numbers, license codes, etc. so I can go back and review where a problem may have crept into the machine)

But, there will be something else that comes along that won't work so he'll be stuck with that same predicament -- and face that same question!
Curious.George is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 12:41 PM   #18
R_J
Badcaps Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
City & State: ☻
My Country: Canada
I'm a: Professional Tech
Posts: 7,103
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

In that first picture, Hostname or IP address, just put in the printers ip address, (like 192.168.0.XXX) Are you using a router or is the printer getting its ip address from your ISP?
R_J is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 12:50 PM   #19
canadaboy25
I hate waiting!
 
canadaboy25's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
City & State: Saskatchewan
My Country: Canada
Line Voltage: 120VAC 60Hz
I'm a: Hobbyist Tech
Posts: 422
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

Quote:
Originally Posted by R_J View Post
In that first picture, Hostname or IP address, just put in the printers ip address, (like 192.168.0.XXX) Are you using a router or is the printer getting its ip address from your ISP?
The printer is connected via USB to the print server of the router. The ip that the router provides is just the router's own ip with the /printers/My_Printer after it.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg printrouter.jpg (149.4 KB, 10 views)
canadaboy25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2018, 12:59 PM   #20
R_J
Badcaps Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
City & State: ☻
My Country: Canada
I'm a: Professional Tech
Posts: 7,103
Default Re: Pages sent to printer sliding off page

My printer is just using its jetdirect card in the printer with a ip address, I have'nt used a print server for a while. (Novell days)
The printer should have its own ip address I think you may be just trying to print to the router address

Last edited by R_J; 09-16-2018 at 01:08 PM..
R_J is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



Badcaps.net Technical Forums 2003 - 2021
Powered by vBulletin ®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:24 AM.
Did you find this forum helpful?