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Old 06-22-2020, 07:44 PM   #1
ChaosLegionnaire
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Default apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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Originally Posted by Reuters
Apple switches to its own chips for Mac computers as it adds features, privacy controls

Apple Inc (AAPL.O) on Monday said it will switch to its own chips for its Mac computers, saying the first machines will ship this year and ending a nearly 15-year reliance on Intel Corp to supply processors for its flagship laptops and desktop.

Apple Chief Executive Tim Cook said it marked the beginning of a major new era for a product line that powered the company’s rise in the 1980s and its resurgence in the late 1990s.

“Silicon is at the heart of our hardware,” Cook said during a virtual keynote address recorded at the company’s Cupertino, California headquarters for its annual developer conference. “Having a world class silicon design team is a game changer.”

The silicon switch brings the Mac into line with the company’s iPhone and iPads, which already use Apple-designed chips. Cook said that Apple expects the Mac transition to take about two years and that Apple still has some Intel-based computers in its pipeline that it will support for “many years.”

But the move will give software developers for Apple’s largest pool of third-party apps - those built for iPhones and iPads - new access to its laptops and desktop for the first time. Apple software chief Craig Federighi said that for those offerings, “most apps will just work, with no changes from the developer” on the new Macs. He also said the “vast majority” of existing apps for Intel-based machines can be modified to work in “just a few days.”

But analysts said Intel would likely to continue to supply Apple with data center chips that power services such as iCloud. In a statement, Intel said Apple remained a customer “across several areas of business” and that it was still focused on the PC market.

“We believe Intel-powered PCs — like those based on our forthcoming Tiger Lake mobile platform — provide global customers the best experience in the areas they value most, as well as the most open platform for developers, both today and into the future,” Intel said.

Ben Bajarin, an analyst with Creative Strategies, said,“There are just standards there (in corporate software) that run on x86” chips from Intel, he said. Apple “cannot abandon that as quickly as they want if they want to maintain the enterprise and commercial share for Mac, which is one of their major segments.”
read more @ Reuters
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Old 06-22-2020, 08:01 PM   #2
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

Far better to read about it here https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/...x86_rebellion/ or here https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020...ay-from-intel/
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Old 06-22-2020, 08:24 PM   #3
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

So we're going back to the PPC days? No more "hackintosh's"?

The last 10 years, Intel has just been getting fatter & lazier....perhaps this will shake 'em up a bit...
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Old 06-22-2020, 10:03 PM   #4
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

Yeah kinda crazy I remember how sad I was when PPC went to intel I felt like the mac lost its soul, and it has especially the new macs that don't have the startup chime. I bought a 2018 mac mini with a i5 8500B right when it was released in 2018 so it'll be interesting to see how long I get software support for. Iam excited for a ARM macbook air as the battery could be amazing maybe even 24 hours but I still don't see how the arm cpu could compete with the top of the line mac pro for content creation.
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Old 06-23-2020, 12:31 AM   #5
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

Well, the Ryzen 7 3700X is decimating most other CPU chips on this planet!

It looks like I'm also whopping 5960Xs!
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Old 06-23-2020, 02:35 AM   #6
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

well they may not use ARM, it could use RiSC5 as it's open-source hardware.
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Old 06-23-2020, 03:26 AM   #7
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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well they may not use ARM, it could use RiSC5 as it's open-source hardware.
No,just ARM.
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Old 06-23-2020, 06:36 AM   #8
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

I'm glad I hate apple.

6502 -> 65816 -> 68000 -> PPC -> x86 -> ARM...

Not like today's PCs can run 8080 or even 8086 software without emulation, but anyway, it's all about vendor lock in, and you can't have that when you have compatible hardware...
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Old 06-23-2020, 07:02 AM   #9
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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I'm glad I hate apple.

6502 -> 65816 -> 68000 -> PPC -> x86 -> ARM...

Not like today's PCs can run 8080 or even 8086 software without emulation, but anyway, it's all about vendor lock in, and you can't have that when you have compatible hardware...
It's about Apple having complete control over their hardware and software, the vast majority of users not caring what powers their shiny. Not having to pay Intel Billions a year I imagine would also have played a part in their decision although their servers will still be Intel for a while if not forever.
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Old 06-23-2020, 09:04 AM   #10
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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No,just ARM.
i have not seen apple themselves actually say that yet.
and a LOT of big company's are now pushing the RiSC5 development because it has no patents to worry about.
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Old 06-23-2020, 09:14 AM   #11
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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It's about Apple having complete control over their hardware and software, the vast majority of users not caring what powers their shiny. Not having to pay Intel Billions a year I imagine would also have played a part in their decision although their servers will still be Intel for a while if not forever.
huh? I thought it was the end user that always pays :\

But you're right, it's 100% about lock-in, complete control of their hardware and software for a "unified experience" ...
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Old 06-23-2020, 09:16 AM   #12
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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i have not seen apple themselves actually say that yet.
and a LOT of big company's are now pushing the RiSC5 development because it has no patents to worry about.
And fragmentation for their own "differentiation" starts in...5...4...3...2...
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Old 06-23-2020, 09:25 AM   #13
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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Yeah kinda crazy I remember how sad I was when PPC went to intel I felt like the mac lost its soul, and it has especially the new macs that don't have the startup chime.
I have a few of the last PPC-based iMac's that still have the startup chime.....these are circa 2006-ish. They were polymod cap experiments. Not really worth anything, but they fit in nice with my retro fleet. One of them has Ubuntu for PPC on it.
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Old 06-23-2020, 09:40 AM   #14
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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I have a few of the last PPC-based iMac's that still have the startup chime.....these are circa 2006-ish. They were polymod cap experiments. Not really worth anything, but they fit in nice with my retro fleet. One of them has Ubuntu for PPC on it.
Nice, I picked up a 2005 model iMac a G5 back in 2011 and it had wavey lines on the video, it had bad caps I actually ordered a complete recap kit from you for it but I was lazy and only replaced the caps on the videocard portion still have the extra caps from your kit lol, it should still be working but I haven't powered it up in about 4 years.
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Old 06-23-2020, 09:44 AM   #15
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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The last 10 years, Intel has just been getting fatter & lazier....perhaps this will shake 'em up a bit...
The years 2012 to 2016, were the worst for Intel, so far. Despite Haswell and Skylake not being too bad.

But Skylake and possibly later, has a notable problem for very thin PCBs, which caused people installing heatsinks to be concerned.
IIRC, this was reported over at overclocking communities. Likely saw news about that at OCF.

Overall, 2012 to 2016 sucked in the CPU price department, which would cause people like me to hold on to socket 775! While others were holding on to socket 1366 of course.

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Old 06-23-2020, 09:52 AM   #16
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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It's about Apple having complete control over their hardware and software, the vast majority of users not caring what powers their shiny.

^This, as far as Apple is concerned being proprietary and incompatible with anything outside of their "ecosystem" is a good thing, and as you mentioned the vast majority of their users are the non-technical types that just want it to work and don't care what is "under the covers".


I definitely hate apple and haven't purchased any of their products since the iPod (and only bought that when they ran everyone else out of the market leaving few options besides cheap "low-end" MP3 players), but I (and most on this forum) aren't their target demographic so they don't care.

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Old 06-23-2020, 10:48 AM   #17
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

For those wondering how an Arm will power a Mac Pro, look at the worlds largest supercomputer for a clue https://www.nextplatform.com/2020/06...n-the-hpc-sun/ more cores.

No more having to design their hardware and software around Intel's releases or supply restrictions, they can refresh their lines at their own pace and with 10 million developers worldwide of apps for their iOS that will now run on the desktop it makes total sense.
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Old 06-23-2020, 10:58 AM   #18
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

Still a lot of serialized applications that core count has a diminishing return on...

Sometimes I wonder, to allow parallelization, some cores may need to sort of duplicate work, and now much energy cost is involved with that versus one fast core serializing everything, and not need to do the "sort of duplicate" work.

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Old 06-23-2020, 02:32 PM   #19
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

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^This, as far as Apple is concerned being proprietary and incompatible with anything outside of their "ecosystem" is a good thing, and as you mentioned the vast majority of their users are the non-technical types that just want it to work and don't care what is "under the covers".
Especially when you see an Intel-based Mac running Windows....I always chuckled at that.
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...While others were holding on to socket 1366 of course.
I'm one of those..... 6 cores @ 3.46GHz + a good GPU, name one thing it can't do over something newer....
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Old 06-23-2020, 03:03 PM   #20
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Default Re: apple dumps intel as chip provider for macs

so, no more bootcamp for apple hardware either? I suppose they specifically want to rid of the hackintoshes anyway so that's something they wanted anyway...

Anyone run QEMU on ARM and how bad is x86 emulation?
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