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    #21
    Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

    Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
    It works great, there is only one minor problem. All the voltage rails are reading a bit high. Especially the 3.3V.
    Check your multimeter batteries. Some multimeters, when they get low batteries, they tend to show higher voltage.

    Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
    I don't think it will cause any problem, i will keep an eye at the voltages.
    Most likely not, even though some of your voltages are outside of ATX spec. But modern motherboards can cope a little better with voltage variations (especially higher voltages), since most chips are behind some type of voltage regulator (be it buck or linear).

    Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
    I really don't want to take this whole thing apart for the third time...
    Yeah, totally understandable. If there is one thing I don't like to do, it's repeat repairs. Had an LCD monitor like last week - big input filter CapXon cap started going bad (leakage from the bung on one lead.)

    Originally posted by Drack View Post
    Actually not, 3.465 is the maximum allowed by ATX specs.
    12.6 is the maximum allowed so as long as it doesn't go beyond that it should be fine.
    +1

    ATX spec calls for +/-5% on 3.3V, 5V, and 12V rails, IIRC. So that's:
    3.135 - 3.465V
    4.75 - 5.25V
    11.4 - 12.6V

    But like I mentioned above, modern motherboards can cope a little easier with voltage variations, especially higher voltages. Back in the days though, some of these rails were used directly to power certain chips. For example, SDRAM was often powered directly from the 3.3V rail and any TTL chips from the 5V rail. So going outside of that specs on voltage (and also ripple) meant potential trouble.

    Nowadays, I think only the LPC SIO is powered directly - typically the 5VSB... if not a 3.3V STBY rail generated from the 5VSB. So in any case, most chips have some type of regulator behind them.

    The only hardware that is still vulnerable are mechanical HDDs. In particular, their spindle motor is often controlled by a chip+FET combo. When ripple is really high or voltage outside of spec, they tend to run hotter and may shorten the lifespan of the HDD.

    Comment


      #22
      Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

      Ok, thanks for your opinions. The final setup is:

      AMD Ryzen 3 1200@3.8Ghz 1.3Vcore
      Coolermaster ML120L RGB water cooler
      2x8GB DDR4 RGB 2666@2933mhz C16 1.35V
      Asrock B450M PRO4
      Gigabyte RX560 OC 4GB (powerlimit removed)
      240GB Kingston SSD

      I have added some pictures. I made them with my PotatoCam©™, so in reality it looks much much better than in the pictures. I also did some mods to the pc:

      - Case panted black from the inside (looks really good)
      - 3D printed bracket to fit 120mm radiator in the 5.25" drive bays
      - Added 2 RGB LED strips
      - Sleeved ALL the cables
      - recapped PSU and replaced 12V rectifier

      That was quite a lot of work. If i run Furmark and Intel Burn Test simultaneously, the 12V rail drops from 12.66V to 11.40V, so won't do that again... But with some heavy gaming, the 12V rail stays around 12.0V, so no worries there. The 5V stays solid at 5.12V and the 3.3V rail stays solid at 3.52V. The system runs stable and quiet. The power supply does run a bit warm, but the efficiency of it is horrible of course and it has got a temperature controlled fan which doesn't really help with thermals.

      I will see what happens. Currently it is purring like a kitten, but who knows for how long.

      EDIT:
      The multimeter has just got a new battery. It's an old Fluke 27, the brown brick that could destroy a Nokia without breaking a sweat.

      EDIT 2:
      I do think the recap and replacement of the 12V rectifier helped. The RX560 with the power limit removed would be drawing around 90 watts with Furmark i think since it is an overclocked version with the power limit removed. Heck, the Asus RX560 OC model (with the same clocks) showed 100W with Furmark, where it's power limit is located. Also the Sapphire RX 560 OC model draws 100W or even more with Furmark. HWmonitor also showed the CPU drawing around 85W with Intel Burn Test. So that is already 175W. Add the fans, SSD, RGB lights, motherboard, VRM efficiency and water pump and i think it would be drawing about 190W. So that already is 16A at the 12V rail. In the review at JonnyGuru, the 12V rail already dropped to 10.7V with a 16A load and that's probably with a bigger load on the 5V rail.
      Attached Files
      Last edited by bauto601; 01-04-2019, 02:41 PM.

      Comment


        #23
        Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

        Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
        That was quite a lot of work. If i run Furmark and Intel Burn Test simultaneously, the 12V rail drops from 12.66V to 11.40V, so won't do that again... But with some heavy gaming, the 12V rail stays around 12.0V, so no worries there. The 5V stays solid at 5.12V and the 3.3V rail stays solid at 3.52V.
        this is typical of those old-design group regulated psus. u have to load both the 5v and 12v rail equally for the voltages to stay in spec. if u load the 12v heavily, the 12v rail will sag and the minor rails will go high.

        so to solve this, either decrease the resistance and increase the wattage of the load resistors on the minor rails or add some dummy lightbulb load on the 5v rail to force the 12v rail voltage to go up.

        if it was too much work for u, then perhaps u should have just bought a more modern independantly regulated designed psu and be done with it lol...

        Comment


          #24
          Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

          Originally posted by ChaosLegionnaire View Post
          this is typical of those old-design group regulated psus. u have to load both the 5v and 12v rail equally for the voltages to stay in spec. if u load the 12v heavily, the 12v rail will sag and the minor rails will go high.

          so to solve this, either decrease the resistance and increase the wattage of the load resistors on the minor rails or add some dummy lightbulb load on the 5v rail to force the 12v rail voltage to go up.

          if it was too much work for u, then perhaps u should have just bought a more modern independantly regulated designed psu and be done with it lol...
          Well, it wasn't too much work. Most of the work was spray painting the case, sleeving the cables, 3D printing and so on...

          I don't think that increasing the load on the 5V rail really helps in this case. It will only cause the 12V and 3.3V rail to increase further. I think that adding a load resistor to the 3.3V would be the best option. The 12V rail stays (even with a drop to 11.4V) inside the ATX specifications. Only the 3.3V rail is a problem.

          Ideally i would open up the power supply and start tinkering with the resistors in the feedback circuit. Increasing the 5V feedback resistor value and adding an extra resistor from the 12V rail to the feedback pin of the microcontroller to make it react to the changing 12V rail. But also then, the 3.3V rail would probably go through the roof if it wants to maintain 12V on the 12V rail.

          It's just weird that the 3.3V/5V ratio is off. The 5V rail at 5.1V isn't that bad, and it keeps that voltage rock solid. The 3.3V rail is too high but drops back a bit (with like 0.05V) under load and the 12V rail drops about 0.5V with a reasonable load.

          Oh well, that's part of the deal when dealing with crap psu's i guess.

          Comment


            #25
            Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            I don't think that increasing the load on the 5V rail really helps in this case. It will only cause the 12V and 3.3V rail to increase further. I think that adding a load resistor to the 3.3V would be the best option. The 12V rail stays (even with a drop to 11.4V) inside the ATX specifications. Only the 3.3V rail is a problem.
            The 3.3V rail shouldn't increase or decrease too much - it is independently regulated with a mag-amp circuit from the 5V rail.

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            Ideally i would open up the power supply and start tinkering with the resistors in the feedback circuit. Increasing the 5V feedback resistor value and adding an extra resistor from the 12V rail to the feedback pin of the microcontroller to make it react to the changing 12V rail. But also then, the 3.3V rail would probably go through the roof if it wants to maintain 12V on the 12V rail.
            No! Don't touch those resistors. You will likely end up screwing the compensation circuit, which could result in wild oscillations and even destruction of the PS. The only thing you can do on some of these old half-bridge PSUs is either increase or decrease the 5V and 12V rail together. The 3.3V rail, as I mentioned, is regulated by a mag-amp and you can change that in a different way.

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            It's just weird that the 3.3V/5V ratio is off.
            To tweak the 3.3V rail, find the 431 shunt that is responsible for regulating the 3.3V rail mag-amp circuit. Some designs may use a small electrolytic cap (0.47 to 2.2 uF) for the compensation network of this shunt. If that small cap has gone bad, this could well be the reason why the 3.3V rail is high all the time. If not, then most likely Apevia just didn't pick the best resistor values for the divider responsible for setting up the 3.3V rail voltage - in which case, you'll just need to tweak the value of the lower resistor in that network (making it higher will drop the 3.3V rail).

            Originally posted by ChaosLegionnaire View Post
            this is typical of those old-design group regulated psus. u have to load both the 5v and 12v rail equally for the voltages to stay in spec. if u load the 12v heavily, the 12v rail will sag and the minor rails will go high.
            Yes, the "old" group-regulated PSUs usually use one set of windings for both the 5V and 12V rail (the 5V rail is simply a tap taken "earlier" before the 12V rail). Hence the reason why these PSUs cross-load fairly easily and typically prefer either only 5V or 12V heavy PCs, depending on which the PSU was designed for.

            On newer group-regulated designs, the 12V rail is simply generated by adding a 7V rail (though a winding on the main transformer that is separate from the 5V rail) on top of the already-rectified 5V rail. Thus, loading the 12V rail also loads the 5V rail with the same current automatically. This reduces the efficiency slightly when using a 12V load, because both the 5V and 12V rectifiers get loaded. But it results in better regulation. Of course, if the output rectifiers are over-specced appropriately, the efficiency wouldn't suffer as much.

            Originally posted by ChaosLegionnaire View Post
            so to solve this, either decrease the resistance and increase the wattage of the load resistors on the minor rails
            That wouldn't work.

            Originally posted by ChaosLegionnaire View Post
            or add some dummy lightbulb load on the 5v rail to force the 12v rail voltage to go up.
            That will like cause an even higher 12V rail when the PC is idle, so probably not appropriate either.

            Truth is, there actually isn't much of a solution for this. Old PSUs like this simply just aren't made for a heavy 12V load. With a heavy 5V-load, they seem to do a little better.

            Originally posted by ChaosLegionnaire View Post
            if it was too much work for u, then perhaps u should have just bought a more modern independantly regulated designed psu and be done with it lol...
            Yes.
            But part of the problem is that this power supply is much shorter than a standard ATX PSU: only 7" long... or short, depending on how you want to look at it (insert inappropriate jokes here )

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            I have added some pictures. I made them with my PotatoCam©™, so in reality it looks much much better than in the pictures.
            IDK, looks pretty good to me already. Nice light mods you got on there.
            (And LOL @ PotatoCam©™ )

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            - 3D printed bracket to fit 120mm radiator in the 5.25" drive bays
            You mean foam wouldn't have been good enough?
            https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...9&d=1544304344
            (Picture by Drack, found in this post )

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            That was quite a lot of work. If i run Furmark and Intel Burn Test simultaneously, the 12V rail drops from 12.66V to 11.40V, so won't do that again...
            That's funny - all the way from one end of the ATX spec allowance to the other. Kind of scary too, IMO. At least I certainly wouldn't keep that setup like that.

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            But with some heavy gaming, the 12V rail stays around 12.0V, so no worries there. The 5V stays solid at 5.12V and the 3.3V rail stays solid at 3.52V. The system runs stable and quiet.
            That sounds a little better. Then again, games don't always stress the system as much as those synthetic benchmarks do. So that's expected.

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            The power supply does run a bit warm, but the efficiency of it is horrible of course and it has got a temperature controlled fan which doesn't really help with thermals.
            It would be interesting to check how much power the PSU is drawing from the wall. Then we might be able to have a better idea of the efficiency. Though being a 2nd tier half-bridge PSU, I don't imagine the efficiency being better than 75%. Probably around 70% most of the time. So with your load of around 190 Watts max, that would mean there's about 60-80 Watts of heat generated inside the PSU, which is somewhat considerable. If the PSU's fans are hardly turning, it might be a good idea to modify the fan circuit... though that means you'll have to take apart the PSU again , which I understand is something you don't want to do. So maybe just leave it as is and keep us posted, say, what happens to this system a year from now or two (if you intend to stay on Badcaps.net that long, of course.)

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            I will see what happens. Currently it is purring like a kitten, but who knows for how long.
            Well, life is no fun without some risks and shenanigans. If the PSU goes *kaboom* , at least you will have a good story to tell.

            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
            I do think the recap and replacement of the 12V rectifier helped.
            Yes, it most certainly did. With the old rectifier, the 12V rail would have probably dipped even much lower, just like on that JG review.

            Comment


              #26
              Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

              Originally posted by momaka View Post
              The 3.3V rail shouldn't increase or decrease too much - it is independently regulated with a mag-amp circuit from the 5V rail.

              Hmm, okay. I did not know that.

              No! Don't touch those resistors. You will likely end up screwing the compensation circuit, which could result in wild oscillations and even destruction of the PS. The only thing you can do on some of these old half-bridge PSUs is either increase or decrease the 5V and 12V rail together. The 3.3V rail, as I mentioned, is regulated by a mag-amp and you can change that in a different way.

              Yes i know that the rails are tied together. But i rather have some more swing on the 5V rail to compensate for the 12V rail. I've also modded a Linkworld power supply for my 3D printer to output 18V instead of 12V. I've also did that by fiddling with the feedback resistors. That unit runs quite happily for more than a year now. But oscillation is something i want to avoid, and for the relative small gains it gives i will leave it as-is since the pro's don't outweight the con's in this occasion.

              To tweak the 3.3V rail, find the 431 shunt that is responsible for regulating the 3.3V rail mag-amp circuit. Some designs may use a small electrolytic cap (0.47 to 2.2 uF) for the compensation network of this shunt. If that small cap has gone bad, this could well be the reason why the 3.3V rail is high all the time. If not, then most likely Apevia just didn't pick the best resistor values for the divider responsible for setting up the 3.3V rail voltage - in which case, you'll just need to tweak the value of the lower resistor in that network (making it higher will drop the 3.3V rail).

              Will look into that, currently i am not going to open it again but when i upgrade the system to Zen 2 / Navi i already have to take the system apart and then i can open up the power supply as well again.


              Yes, the "old" group-regulated PSUs usually use one set of windings for both the 5V and 12V rail (the 5V rail is simply a tap taken "earlier" before the 12V rail). Hence the reason why these PSUs cross-load fairly easily and typically prefer either only 5V or 12V heavy PCs, depending on which the PSU was designed for.

              On newer group-regulated designs, the 12V rail is simply generated by adding a 7V rail (though a winding on the main transformer that is separate from the 5V rail) on top of the already-rectified 5V rail. Thus, loading the 12V rail also loads the 5V rail with the same current automatically. This reduces the efficiency slightly when using a 12V load, because both the 5V and 12V rectifiers get loaded. But it results in better regulation. Of course, if the output rectifiers are over-specced appropriately, the efficiency wouldn't suffer as much.

              That is some clever thinking of the PSU manufacturers. Unfortunately, Young-Year works with monkey engineers.


              That will like cause an even higher 12V rail when the PC is idle, so probably not appropriate either.

              Truth is, there actually isn't much of a solution for this. Old PSUs like this simply just aren't made for a heavy 12V load. With a heavy 5V-load, they seem to do a little better.

              Yes, the only thing i can do is try to make the 12V better. But by adding a feedback resistor from the 12V rail, idle 12V should be better but the 5V rail would drop a bit. Under load, 5V would be higher and the 12V shouldn't dip too as much. But then again, risky operation.


              Yes.
              But part of the problem is that this power supply is much shorter than a standard ATX PSU: only 7" long... or short, depending on how you want to look at it (insert inappropriate jokes here )

              No comment.


              IDK, looks pretty good to me already. Nice light mods you got on there.
              (And LOL @ PotatoCam©™ )

              Yeah, i really like this case now. The hardware/case combo with LED's is just right. Especially when you know it's a budget build.

              You mean foam wouldn't have been good enough?
              https://www.badcaps.net/forum/attach...9&d=1544304344
              (Picture by Drack, found in this post )

              Aww, dang it. Should have done that instead.

              That's funny - all the way from one end of the ATX spec allowance to the other. Kind of scary too, IMO. At least I certainly wouldn't keep that setup like that.

              Young-Year really set this up to run inside the ATX specs.


              That sounds a little better. Then again, games don't always stress the system as much as those synthetic benchmarks do. So that's expected.


              It would be interesting to check how much power the PSU is drawing from the wall. Then we might be able to have a better idea of the efficiency. Though being a 2nd tier half-bridge PSU, I don't imagine the efficiency being better than 75%. Probably around 70% most of the time. So with your load of around 190 Watts max, that would mean there's about 60-80 Watts of heat generated inside the PSU, which is somewhat considerable. If the PSU's fans are hardly turning, it might be a good idea to modify the fan circuit... though that means you'll have to take apart the PSU again , which I understand is something you don't want to do. So maybe just leave it as is and keep us posted, say, what happens to this system a year from now or two (if you intend to stay on Badcaps.net that long, of course.)

              Of course i will stay on Badcaps, i'm mostly reading here. But sometimes i need some insights from people who know much more about ATX PSU's than i do. Will keep you updated, altough no news is good news. Will also do a power measurement when i have time to buy a meter and test it.


              Well, life is no fun without some risks and shenanigans. If the PSU goes *kaboom* , at least you will have a good story to tell.

              It will definately bring a new dimension to Battlefield or GTA.


              Yes, it most certainly did. With the old rectifier, the 12V rail would have probably dipped even much lower, just like on that JG review.

              I'm really happy with how it performs now. I expected it half to blow up or really go big way out of spec. It's running hot so a fan mod has to be done when it gets opened up again. But for now, i am satisfied by the Young-Year monkytech. I also got an Owon DSO oscilloscope, so maybe i can do some ripple measurements? Or will the PC itself as a load cause too much ripple to get an idea of what the ripple level would be? There is also a part on my mind that says "Don't measure it, you don't want to know it." since it works fine.
              __

              Comment


                #27
                Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                Status update. The PSU still working, altough it runs a little hot. The case temp rises up to 35 degrees while gaming and the PSU intake is right above the graphics card so that doesn't help it either. The system runs rock solid and produces some decent fps numbers in BeamNG drive and Forza Motorsport 7. I'm even starting to trust this unit now. And it runs quiet, which i also didn't expect.

                Comment


                  #28
                  Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                  Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
                  I'm even starting to trust this unit now.
                  It's OK to trust it. Just watch out if you get any brown-outs.
                  Many cheaper half-bridge PSUs can't deal too well with low line voltages and can sometimes blow up... possibly taking out something in the process too.

                  Comment


                    #29
                    Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                    Originally posted by momaka View Post
                    It's OK to trust it. Just watch out if you get any brown-outs.
                    Many cheaper half-bridge PSUs can't deal too well with low line voltages and can sometimes blow up... possibly taking out something in the process too.
                    Over in the U.S., Canada and Mexico, do you think that 113V and the like would make many cheap PSUs blow?

                    I start worrying when I see my circuit drop to 118 V or the like, meaning that it's likely saturated and thus a circuit breaker trip around the corner...
                    Last edited by RJARRRPCGP; 01-31-2019, 09:06 PM.
                    ASRock B550 PG Velocita

                    Ryzen 9 "Vermeer" 5900X

                    16 GB AData XPG Spectrix D41

                    Sapphire Nitro+ Radeon RX 6750 XT

                    eVGA Supernova G3 750W

                    Western Digital Black SN850 1TB NVMe SSD

                    Alienware AW3423DWF OLED




                    "¡Me encanta "Me Encanta o Enlistarlo con Hilary Farr!" -Mí mismo

                    "There's nothing more unattractive than a chick smoking a cigarette" -Topcat

                    "Today's lesson in pissivity comes in the form of a ziplock baggie full of GPU extension brackets & hardware that for the last ~3 years have been on my bench, always in my way, getting moved around constantly....and yesterday I found myself in need of them....and the bastards are now nowhere to be found! Motherfracker!!" -Topcat

                    "did I see a chair fly? I think I did! Time for popcorn!" -ratdude747

                    Comment


                      #30
                      Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                      Originally posted by RJARRRPCGP View Post
                      Over in the U.S., Canada and Mexico, do you think that 113V and the like would make many cheap PSUs blow?
                      No.
                      Usually 80-100V is where they may start to drop out of regulation. The cheap nasty h-bridgers will try to work regardless, which is the sad part. One I tested at very low line voltage on purpose (probably around 55V). It output about 1-4V on the major rails without shutting down. Clearly it should have shut down. But it kept trying.
                      Most aren't like that, though, and will typically reach saturation on the driver transformer, buzz, and then shut down gracefully.

                      Comment


                        #31
                        Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                        Originally posted by momaka View Post
                        No.
                        Usually 80-100V is where they may start to drop out of regulation.
                        Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if my UPS clicks in to battery mode already at that point, especially my brand new CyberPower UPS that I got. I set it to the most sensitive setting.
                        ASRock B550 PG Velocita

                        Ryzen 9 "Vermeer" 5900X

                        16 GB AData XPG Spectrix D41

                        Sapphire Nitro+ Radeon RX 6750 XT

                        eVGA Supernova G3 750W

                        Western Digital Black SN850 1TB NVMe SSD

                        Alienware AW3423DWF OLED




                        "¡Me encanta "Me Encanta o Enlistarlo con Hilary Farr!" -Mí mismo

                        "There's nothing more unattractive than a chick smoking a cigarette" -Topcat

                        "Today's lesson in pissivity comes in the form of a ziplock baggie full of GPU extension brackets & hardware that for the last ~3 years have been on my bench, always in my way, getting moved around constantly....and yesterday I found myself in need of them....and the bastards are now nowhere to be found! Motherfracker!!" -Topcat

                        "did I see a chair fly? I think I did! Time for popcorn!" -ratdude747

                        Comment


                          #32
                          Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                          Luckily, i live in the Netherlands. We rarely have brownouts here. Mostly it is normal power or no power. But brownouts are very rare out here. It's running happy and hot, i just hope it will stay that way. Although the primary caps are still the original Capxon 470uF ones, which probably are 330uF in reality since they look too small to be 470uF.

                          Comment


                            #33
                            Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                            Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
                            Although the primary caps are still the original Capxon 470uF ones, which probably are 330uF in reality since they look too small to be 470uF.
                            You got only 470 uF primary caps in that PSU? Ouch! I'd say the PSU is then built more like a 250 Watt unit (though I think we established that already. ). Maybe 200 Watt, if the primary caps do measure closer to 330 uF... though CapXon primary caps typically do measure what is printed on their label. The bigger question for CapXon is: when will they fail?

                            Comment


                              #34
                              Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                              Originally posted by RJARRRPCGP View Post
                              (And of course, the DDR2 SDRAM that was probably slower than DDR1, LOL)
                              I think I likely saw that variant of DDR2 SDRAM on a 2006 system, LOL!
                              ASRock B550 PG Velocita

                              Ryzen 9 "Vermeer" 5900X

                              16 GB AData XPG Spectrix D41

                              Sapphire Nitro+ Radeon RX 6750 XT

                              eVGA Supernova G3 750W

                              Western Digital Black SN850 1TB NVMe SSD

                              Alienware AW3423DWF OLED




                              "¡Me encanta "Me Encanta o Enlistarlo con Hilary Farr!" -Mí mismo

                              "There's nothing more unattractive than a chick smoking a cigarette" -Topcat

                              "Today's lesson in pissivity comes in the form of a ziplock baggie full of GPU extension brackets & hardware that for the last ~3 years have been on my bench, always in my way, getting moved around constantly....and yesterday I found myself in need of them....and the bastards are now nowhere to be found! Motherfracker!!" -Topcat

                              "did I see a chair fly? I think I did! Time for popcorn!" -ratdude747

                              Comment


                                #35
                                Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                                Originally posted by momaka View Post
                                You got only 470 uF primary caps in that PSU? Ouch! I'd say the PSU is then built more like a 250 Watt unit (though I think we established that already. ). Maybe 200 Watt, if the primary caps do measure closer to 330 uF... though CapXon primary caps typically do measure what is printed on their label. The bigger question for CapXon is: when will they fail?
                                Yeah, the PSU definately is a 250W unit at it's peak. The PFC coil (which is real, checked that) shows proudly 250W. Altough i wouldn't be that proud on such a number. It really is a scaled down model with all the cost and size cutting measures. I wanted to replace to primary caps too, but i could only find 330uF caps that had the same size. They are 105c rated and since primary caps aren't that prone to fail, i just left them sitting there.

                                Comment


                                  #36
                                  Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                                  Originally posted by bauto601 View Post
                                  They are 105c rated and since primary caps aren't that prone to fail, i just left them sitting there.
                                  Yeah, that's true - primary caps don't fail often in ATX PSUs with PPFC and no PFC. For APFC units, though... I'd be worried. Also, I've seen a few primary-side CapXon caps fail in hot LCD monitors. Otherwise, I myself have several "old-style" ATX PSUs without APFC and CapXon caps. So far, they are still holding up okay, it seems.

                                  Comment


                                    #37
                                    Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                                    Well, the PSU still works, didn't have any stability problems. The system has been upgraded a month ago with an additional 1TB SSD and a GTX 1650 Super.

                                    After this upgrade, the 3.3V rail dropped with around 0.05V, which is good in this case. After playing BeamNG for an hour (which is very heavy on the CPU and GPU) the PSU did get quite hot and the system started to turn on and off really quickly. After unplugging it and plugging it in again it works fine.

                                    I think that could have been the over temperature protection, since the 80mm fan doesn't really move much air and as a result it's cooking itself. So i removed the OC on the CPU and now i hope it won't give any problems during the summer. Also added some pictures to show the casemod.
                                    Attached Files

                                    Comment


                                      #38
                                      Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                                      Thanks for sharing pictures of your work. Looks really good and great to hear it's still running well.

                                      I guess this shows that even an older half-bridge PSU can be useful once recapped with good caps and a few mods done to it.

                                      Comment


                                        #39
                                        Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                                        Originally posted by momaka View Post
                                        Thanks for sharing pictures of your work. Looks really good and great to hear it's still running well.

                                        I guess this shows that even an older half-bridge PSU can be useful once recapped with good caps and a few mods done to it.
                                        Yup, it's still quite useful for low power pc's. But the voltage regulation is not that great from my experience and as seen in the JG review. Modding the fan speed controller for a more agressive fan curve and modifying the mag-amp circuit for the somewhat high 3.3V rail will make it as good as it will get. The system is running stable though, which in the end is all a power supply needs to do.
                                        The other shallow PSU i modded and posted in the gutless thread is going to replace it. (after a nice repaint) That one runs much cooler, has much better voltage regulation and is capable of delivering way more power.

                                        This PC pulls about ~220W max from the socket. Assuming 75% efficiency (only because of the 230V here, in the JG review the efficiency was more around the 70% mark) the PC needs about 165 watts, which seems about right. That will be an easy job for the new modded unit since i already pulled 220W alone from the 12V rail while testing it.
                                        Last edited by bauto601; 05-22-2020, 12:26 PM.

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                                          #40
                                          Re: A "nice" YoungYear unit?

                                          Just a small update on this PSU project It's still chugging along nicely. The CPU has recently been replaced with a Ryzen 5500 with a small oc to 4.5GHz boost and the ram had some headroom as well, from 2666C16 all the way to 3600C16, not bad for early DDR4 memory. The current system configuration:

                                          - AMD Ryzen 5500 @4.5GHz Boost
                                          - Cooler Master ML120L RGB AIO CPU Cooler
                                          - 16GB DDR4 2666C16 @3600C16
                                          - Asrock B450M Pro4
                                          - 1TB SSD + 256GB SSD
                                          - Geforce GTX1650 Super 4GB
                                          - Some additional RGB lighting


                                          In the summer during longer gaming sesssion the case temp can read up to ~46 degrees right where the intake is of the power supply so i really can't fault it for it's performance and reliability up to this day. Still haven't gotten around to replace it with the other PSU that i prepared for this build a couple of years ago.

                                          In the meantime i had a Cooler Master MWE White 450W fail on me after a year in a relatively low-power file server. It was a really weird failure where the PCB had a burn mark on quite a thick 240v input trace without any further damage to be seen. And the circuit breaker tripped. It was always connected to an APC UPS so it should've had an easy life. Sometimes luck needs to be on your side i guess.

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