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Old 09-02-2016, 05:24 AM   #1
Delirious
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Default Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Hello all,


I just registered on this forum and hope that someone might be able to help me. I am trying to repair an older B&W Zeppelin for my parents. The status light is blinking red which according to B&W means that it need a repair. I searched a little bit around the internet and the power supply of this product seems to be a common problem.

I decided to open it up and take out the power supply. The first thing I noticed was that all the caps seems to be of good quality. Rubycon on the dc side and Panasonic on the ac side. (Excuse my terminology I am very much a beginner here).

However one of the caps a rubycon 2200 uF 16 VDC seems to slightly be bulging. Also there seems to be several burned spots on the backside of the pcb.


So as I see it there are two options:

- Replace some caps?
- Replace the power supply board for a new one (expensive)


Replacing the whole power supply will be quite expensive however might be worth it if this is where the fault lies. But how sure can I be that it is the psu? Also I have never replaced caps before at all so I am very much a beginner. Please keep that in mind.


I have attached some pictures of the board. Any help will be appreciated. The name and make of the psu is Abletec ALP0050-0000-H. Specs: +25V max 1A continuous 2.2A FTC/+5V max 1.5A continuous.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 2016-09-02 11.19.35.jpg (447.9 KB, 251 views)
File Type: jpg 2016-09-02 11.19.41.jpg (555.8 KB, 211 views)
File Type: jpg 2016-09-02 11.19.56.jpg (461.9 KB, 261 views)
File Type: jpg 2016-09-02 13.28.24.jpg (598.4 KB, 196 views)
File Type: jpg 2016-09-02 13.28.32.jpg (579.7 KB, 191 views)

Last edited by Delirious; 09-02-2016 at 05:29 AM..
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Old 09-02-2016, 06:11 AM   #2
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

nothing is burned, the brown is flux.

that cap top-right is bad, as you dont have an esr meter, yuo may as well change the whole group of 4 to be sure.
what exactly do they say on them?
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Old 09-02-2016, 06:22 AM   #3
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Going by the just-visible markings, i'd say that bulged(?) cap is a Rubycon ZL(H?), 2200u / 16v.

The bigger cap on the bottom right is a ZL 1000u / 35v, so it's a safe-enough bet the suspect one's a ZL as well.
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Old 09-02-2016, 06:23 AM   #4
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

PSU is still in a good shape. Nothing burnt, but one cap (top right) is bad.

x2 on stj's comment.
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Old 09-02-2016, 09:45 AM   #5
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Thank you all. This is really good to know. I guess it is worth it to replace the capacitors. How confident can I be that the capacitors are the problem here?

Capacitors:

Top right (bulged) - Rubycon ZLH 2200 uF 16 VDC
Middle one left - Rubycon XYG 470 uF 16 VDC
Middle one right - Rubycon ZLH 220 uF 35 VDC
Bottom right - Rubycon ZL 1000 uF 35 VDC

Is new Rubycon caps a good replacement? They are easily available for me. Panasonic is also possible I think.


Also what is the white liquid? I am thinking it is thermal paste. If so can I replace it with thermal paste used for vga and cpu coolers? Or is there a better type to use.


Also how can you be so sure the top right cap is bad? Just curious. This is very helpful for me.
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Old 09-02-2016, 10:16 AM   #6
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

right, lots of questions.

rubycon is good, they only really fail from heat.
make sure you use the same series (ZLH, YXG etc.)

white stuff is nasty silicon grease, clean it off and use cpu cooler paste if you want - it will do the job better, but it's hardly critical.

caps should have a perfectly flat top, if it's slightly domed them the chemical inside has produced gas and created pressure.
sometimes instead of the top doming and then eventually bursting, the pressure forces the liquid out around the legs btw.
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Old 09-02-2016, 10:32 AM   #7
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Thanks!

So are you saying I should use lets say Rubycon ZLH for all the caps I replace?

The reason I asked about the silicon grease was because I managed to remove quite a bit off it when removing and handling the board. Should I maybe add more?


Any point in replacing the Panasonic caps?
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Old 09-02-2016, 12:42 PM   #8
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

At least your version uses RUBYCON instead of the crappy caps.
http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthr...ighlight=B%26W
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Old 09-02-2016, 01:15 PM   #9
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delirious View Post
Thanks!

So are you saying I should use lets say Rubycon ZLH for all the caps I replace?
no, i meant match them all.
i just wonder if it matters because they used all different types.

if it's not important then i would just stuff it full of panasonic FR series.
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Old 09-02-2016, 04:33 PM   #10
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Would it be wise to replace the two 47 uF 400 VDC capacitors on the AC side as well?

Budm: Well I guess I got quite lucky compared to you.
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Old 09-02-2016, 04:50 PM   #11
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

usually not needed.
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Old 09-02-2016, 05:02 PM   #12
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Thanks I will go with the Panasonic FR as you recommended.
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Old 09-20-2016, 08:03 PM   #13
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Panasonic capacitors are part of the top greatest capacitors manufacturers along with Nippon Chelmicon, Rubycon, Nichicon, etc.
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Old 12-28-2016, 10:50 PM   #14
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

I have the red light flashing, took mine apart and can't see any swollen damaged chips caps anywhere. Help
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Old 05-27-2018, 10:30 AM   #15
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Hi Delirious
What actually was wrong. you wrote in your latest post that you did fix it.
Thx :-)
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Old 08-15-2019, 08:15 PM   #16
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Wow! Using this thread and the iFixit guides https://www.ifixit.com/Wiki/How_to_R...f_the_Zeppelin and https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/How+to+...Zeppelin/55158, I was able to replace the 2200uf 16V and 470uF 16V Samxon caps (whose tops were inflated and didn't test out) with Panasonic FRs from Mouser and it is working. I had a lot of trouble desoldering the caps and in the process destroyed the solder pads, so I didn't think I was able to solder the new ones in well, but I put it back together and the Zeppelin is working so I must have managed it! I have not been able to get the covers back on completely... For anyone else who tries this, be careful to desolder without destroying the solder pad (wick worked better for me than pump) and make sure you note the polarity and the stripe on the cap so that you get the new one in correctly. If anyone has any advice on how to get the covers to snap into place, I'd appreciate it. Thanks to all (Delirious, sti, Khron, Capleaker, budm, phil - all of whom posted helpful info).
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Old 01-02-2020, 12:21 PM   #17
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Great thread! I'm also repairing my Zeppelin and in my case the Rubycon 2200uf 16V capacitor was bulging and the T-fuse had popped.
And the white silicone whatever will be replaced!
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Old 02-24-2020, 06:07 AM   #18
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Good thread. Very grateful to find this. I've got an original B&W zeppelin with the red flashing light problem. it went back to B&W once in ~2014 for a free fix under warranty. But the problem has resurfaced. Maybe bad/cheap components? or maybe a poor design. I don't know. it you look on ebay there are dozens of broken Zeppelin listed.

If anyone else follows this path. As of emails I has with B&W in Feb 2020 they no longer offer support for the original Zeppelin. (previously there was a £80 B&W repair service as i understand).

So its a DIY fix or the Zeppelin goes in the bin.

When it works the sound from the Zeppelin is FANTASTIC. So I've ordered some capacitors and solder and will give the fix a try and hope my soldering skills are up to the job.
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Old 02-24-2020, 10:56 AM   #19
stj
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

they probably shouldnt of named it after something that went up in flames!
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Old 03-08-2020, 10:51 AM   #20
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Default Re: Troubleshooting B&W Original Powersupply

Hi,

Which are the suspect caps here? Not as obvious bulging as id have expected.

The two small ones between the two larger?

Thanks
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