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    Building my first HTPC

    After years of fantasizing about a PC in my living room to replace/compliment my existing AV equipment, my dreams are finally coming true.

    Thanks to hardware donations from family members and pulls from my previous builds, I have a decent starting point for this project. Oh yeah, and this site deserves credit too otherwise all I'd have is a board with bloated vcore caps and a bunch of misc. parts.

    So before I begin buying/assembling parts I'm interested in find out who else has built an HTPC and what kind of software/hardware it's running on. Your opinions on what I was planning would be awesome too.

    Current parts on hand are:
    MSI-7125 socket 939
    Athlon X2 4400
    2GB Ram
    Radeon 5450 (1gb)
    250GB HD
    Sabrent Wireless G PCI card
    DVD/CD writer (it's a few years old now and I'm not sure of the speed but it should suffice for backing up dvds/cds)

    Components on my wish list:
    IOGEAR GKM561R Black 2.4GHz Wireless HTPC Multimedia Keyboard with Laser Trackball and Scroll Wheel ($49.99 w/Promo Code until oct. 22)

    ASUS Black 8X BD-ROM 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-ROM SATA Internal Blu-ray Drive Model BC-08B1LT/BLK/B/ASUS - OEM


    SilverStone Lascala LC17B Black Aluminum Desktop Case

    Total Cost including shipping/taxes $317.22

    The part I'm hung up on what I need to buy to also make this thing a PVR/DVR. I've looked at tuner cards but I'm not sure if they are right choice atm. Tv stations aren't being forced to broadcast digitally OTA until Aug. 31, 2011 and not many have volunteered to start already. I'm probably going to stick with my satellite provider regardless but it would be nice to be able to record other shows to watch later through the PC.

    #2
    Re: Building my first HTPC

    Originally posted by Deft View Post
    MSI-7125 socket 939
    Athlon X2 4400
    2GB Ram
    Radeon 5450 (1gb)
    250GB HD
    Sabrent Wireless G PCI card
    DVD/CD writer (it's a few years old now and I'm not sure of the speed but it should suffice for backing up dvds/cds)

    Components on my wish list:
    IOGEAR GKM561R Black 2.4GHz Wireless HTPC Multimedia Keyboard with Laser Trackball and Scroll Wheel ($49.99 w/Promo Code until oct. 22)

    ASUS Black 8X BD-ROM 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-ROM SATA Internal Blu-ray Drive Model BC-08B1LT/BLK/B/ASUS - OEM


    SilverStone Lascala LC17B Black Aluminum Desktop Case

    Total Cost including shipping/taxes $317.22
    If you plan on using this solely for a HTPC, I would reconsider some of the hardware: the 5450 (while it's a great card) is overkill for a HTPC, look for a cheap 3450 or 3650 (fanless version if possible), all you want the card for is to offload some of the encoding/decoding. If you're going to be recording high definition, you'll want to eventually install a larger HDD (unless you are planning on watching/deleting a LOT). Consider this case (note the size though, it's a little larger than a standard HTPC case). Replace the keyboard/mouse with a remote if it'll just be a HTPC, like this one. That model also has an IR blaster so it can control the TV and/or settop box (to change channels, etc.).

    Originally posted by Deft View Post
    The part I'm hung up on what I need to buy to also make this thing a PVR/DVR. I've looked at tuner cards but I'm not sure if they are right choice atm. Tv stations aren't being forced to broadcast digitally OTA until Aug. 31, 2011 and not many have volunteered to start already. I'm probably going to stick with my satellite provider regardless but it would be nice to be able to record other shows to watch later through the PC.
    Unfortunately, I don't know anything about broadcast TV in Canada, so hopefully someone else will fill us in. It sounds like you are planning on going solely OTA. I would check out http://www.tvfool.com, it looks like they have info for Canada on distance and direction to transmitters, channel ranges, etc. The card that I ended up getting for OTA (ATSC) and ClearQAM (cable) is the AverMedia Duet, and according to the reviews someone said it can tune Canadian channels OTA (in Montreal). I would seriously consider getting a flavor of Windows 7 and using Media Center, but XBMC is also a popular choice. If you end up installing more than 2 tuners, you'll want to increase the amount of RAM in the system to at least 4GB.

    One last thing, if you are connecting 54g wireless, you may not be able to stream 1080p content (link saturation). Good luck and have fun with this!

    Comment


      #3
      Re: Building my first HTPC

      The 5450 card was bought by my uncle back in the spring for that 939 board I have now. Basically, I don't feel like replacing the card since I never paid for it

      That case is an excellent suggestion. With shipping it's still $40 cheaper than the one I wanted to pick up locally. I didn't even notice that case even though I had looked at about a dozen different models. If I can't find a better price for the Silverstone then that Apevia might be the best option.

      The 250gb HD is there just because I already have it.. also my main PC is always on and has about 1.2TB of storage space that I can stream stuff from. (I was considering adding a 2TB drive to that PC and moving the 640GB drive to the HTPC)

      The keyboard I linked to is actually a keyboard with trackball built in. I like the fact that it's small, all in one, wireless and cheap This box will definitely be used for browsing websites and maybe even posting on message boards. Also, I've seen a lot of tuner cards come with remotes.. are they good for anything other than the card they come with?

      Thanks for the link to TVFool. Hopefully that'll fill me in on all the details of receiving digital OTA channels.

      As for Media Center, I only discovered it existed recently when I started looking into all this stuff. I've tested it out on my other PC and it looks real nice. Is it on every version of Win7? I ask because (this page was no help) and I have a spare license that was bought through a student discount MS was offering when win 7 was first released. Not sure of version that license is for since I never used it and forgot I even had it until I started thinking about building this HTPC. I have several licenses for XP still kickin around too if I need 'em.

      Comment


        #4
        Re: Building my first HTPC

        Fair enough on the video card. I was only concerned about power/heat/noise -- if it'll be in a noisy environment you won't notice the difference. The Apevia case actually goes on "special" often and you can pick it up for $30-$35 after rebate if you are patient (I actually have 3 of them and love them). I haven't opened the power supplies yet but will be swapping Antec Earthwatts 380s in there since they are on 24/7.

        Media Center is in all editions as far as I know (maybe not the Enterprise), but Home Premium, Pro and Ultimate have it for sure. One way you can leverage HDD space issues is to convert from WTV to H.264 using MCEBuddy. It's not uncommon to see HD programming take up 5-6GB per hour in WTV format (used by Media Center).

        Not sure about the remotes that come with the tuners, but I think you'll probably want one no matter what you end up going with.

        Comment


          #5
          Re: Building my first HTPC

          It might also be an idea to use an aftermarket cooler, as S939 Athlons run a bit hot and the stock coolers can get noisy.

          This one looks like it would be good (if it fits in the case)
          I love putting bad caps and flat batteries in fire and watching them explode!!

          No wonder it doesn't work! You installed the jumper wires backwards

          Main PC: Core i7 3770K 3.5GHz, Gigabyte GA-Z77M-D3H-MVP, 8GB Kingston HyperX DDR3 1600, 240GB Intel 335 Series SSD, 750GB WD HDD, Sony Optiarc DVD RW, Palit nVidia GTX660 Ti, CoolerMaster N200 Case, Delta DPS-600MB 600W PSU, Hauppauge TV Tuner, Windows 7 Home Premium

          Office PC: HP ProLiant ML150 G3, 2x Xeon E5335 2GHz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, 120GB Intel 530 SSD, 2x 250GB HDD, 2x 450GB 15K SAS HDD in RAID 1, 1x 2TB HDD, nVidia 8400GS, Delta DPS-650BB 650W PSU, Windows 7 Pro

          Comment


            #6
            Re: Building my first HTPC

            I am running Windows 7 MCE on my machine. It is not a dedicated HTPC, but I have an HD tuner in it and use to record/watch TV on the daily. Wrog's estimate for WTV format is spot on. Last night's House (1 hour show) is taking up 7 GB on my drive.

            I think it is well worth it. WTV looks fantastic. I can't tell any difference between watching a live HD OTA stream and watching it after it's been recorded as WTV. Hard drives are dirt cheap these days. I say pop two or three 500GB or bigger drives in there, set MCE to record the highest quality possible, and let er' rip!

            Comment


              #7
              Re: Building my first HTPC

              Originally posted by c_hegge View Post
              It might also be an idea to use an aftermarket cooler, as S939 Athlons run a bit hot and the stock coolers can get noisy.

              This one looks like it would be good (if it fits in the case)
              I have this HSF from a PC 3 I built years ago (board died because of bad caps after 2.5 years and it's still awaiting recapping). The HS is copper and it works quite well. The fan started making noise after about 2 years so I replaced it with an 80mm Artic Cooling fan which is so much quieter. The original fan was 92mm thought (it has mounting holes for both sizes).. I'll probably swap the 80mm fan for a 92mm AC fan at some point.

              Speaking of cooling and noise... The loudest fan I have to deal with is the one for the chipset. I really find those tiny little fans so irritating. I'd like to find a replacement HS for it and have a fan blowing across it. The only issue is that the chipset is placed too close to my graphics card so the HS needs to be the same width.

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Building my first HTPC

                @wrog The video card is fanless, so no noise there.. A lot of the cooling will depend on the configuration of the case fans and ventilation holes. I like the fact that the Apevia X-Master case has mounts for two 120mm fans.. The Silverstone case I wanted seems to only support 80mm fans :/


                7GB for an hour of TV.. wow. I didn't expect that but I get why it up so much space. I can live with only being able to store up to 25 hours of HD TV.. For me that's like 3-4 weeks worth of shows. I'd probably erase shows after I'm done watching them anyway.


                I need to look into these IR blasters a little more too.. I would really love to be able to browse through Media Centre and play movies/music with a remote. Also, when my friends come over I obviously want to be able to brag about how simple and convenient the system is

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: Building my first HTPC

                  Originally posted by weirdlookinguy View Post
                  I am running Windows 7 MCE on my machine. It is not a dedicated HTPC, but I have an HD tuner in it and use to record/watch TV on the daily. Wrog's estimate for WTV format is spot on. Last night's House (1 hour show) is taking up 7 GB on my drive.
                  Mind if I ask what tuner you have and if it came with a remote? If it did, what else can you control with it and it is easy to use?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Building my first HTPC

                    Originally posted by Deft View Post
                    @wrog The video card is fanless, so no noise there.. A lot of the cooling will depend on the configuration of the case fans and ventilation holes. I like the fact that the Apevia X-Master case has mounts for two 120mm fans.. The Silverstone case I wanted seems to only support 80mm fans :/
                    No kidding -- I didn't realize they made a fanless 5450, that is excellent! I originally thought I would be using the 120mm fans mounted on each side of the Apevia case, but believe it or not, the double 80mm exhaust in the rear keeps everything adequately cool.

                    Originally posted by Deft View Post
                    I need to look into these IR blasters a little more too.. I would really love to be able to browse through Media Centre and play movies/music with a remote. Also, when my friends come over I obviously want to be able to brag about how simple and convenient the system is
                    Note that the IR blaster is only necessary if you want to control things other than Media Center (not sure if that was your intention, because MC can play TV/movies/music/photos). Honestly, our Living Room HTPC is probably one of the best purchases in the last few years, we like it that much!

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: Building my first HTPC

                      I am using the Diamond HD Wonder 650 tuner card. It has a Samsung tuner and the ATI Theater chip, which interfaces with my Radeon 4850 and provides hardware mpeg2 and hardware acceleration for many things video-related. You have an ATI card too, maybe you should look into HD tuners with the ATI Theater chip so that you can get the most out of your hardware.

                      The card did not come with a remote but there is a more expensive version of it that does come with a remote. The card does great with OTA, but I have read in many places online that it has some major signal strength issues with QAM so I'd steer clear of this card if you plan on doing anything other than OTA.

                      The system, just in case you're interested:
                      Windows 7 Ultimate
                      Diamond HD Wonder 650
                      ATI Radeon 4850
                      Core 2 Duo E7500
                      Gigabyte EP45-UD3P
                      6GB DDR2
                      640GB WD Caviar Black
                      400w Delta PSU w/ 120mm fan ('tis a very quiet, cool-running PSU)
                      Last edited by weirdlookinguy; 10-20-2010, 11:41 AM.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: Building my first HTPC

                        I was checking out the HD Wonder 650..the cheapest price for the PCI-E version is $85 but the external USB version is only $50 so I might get the USB version and modify it to sit inside the case if it's possible. Gonna look at some hauppage cards first though.. I'm definitely interested in getting a tuner/antenna setup asap now that I know people in my area have been able to get 20+ HD OTA channels from Buffalo/Rochester/Toronto. Thanks for Wrog/Weirdguy for helping me figure this stuff out.

                        So far I've only pulled the trigger on that IOGEAR Keyboard w/Trackball and I'm gonna put my plans of getting a BD-ROM on hold for the moment. I tend to go to the movies more than I rent/buy discs. Hopefully after the weekend I'll have decided on exactly what I'm going to buy.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: Building my first HTPC

                          If you're doing OTA, check out my writeup (with pictures!):

                          https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9317

                          I got my PCI-E HD Wonder 650 for $30... where are you looking for it?

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: Building my first HTPC

                            Thanks for linking to your post.. The picture quality you're getting from that homemade antenna is pretty good. I'll make my own before I ever buy one. But before I build my own I'll see if I can find someone with an old UHF antenna on their roof willing to get rid of it

                            Newegg.ca didn't have the HD 650 model so I just googled for it. They do have the HD 750 w/Remote but it's $65 and is software encoding :/ After looking through some more google results I did find a PCI-E version of the 650 for $54+shipping but that's probably as good as it will get. If after the weekend I can't find it locally for around the same price I'll probably order it on Monday. I'm kinda hoping to have something put together for the following weekend.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: Building my first HTPC

                              Originally posted by Wrog View Post
                              One last thing, if you are connecting 54g wireless, you may not be able to stream 1080p content (link saturation).
                              I have a 3mb connection that delivers 2.6 continuously to the wired router.
                              This drops to about 2.2 after passing through a Linksys access point working as a wireless client to the router. 2.2mb ain't enough to stream HD. I have a brand new Samsung Series 650.

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Re: Building my first HTPC

                                Originally posted by bgavin View Post
                                I have a 3mb connection that delivers 2.6 continuously to the wired router.
                                This drops to about 2.2 after passing through a Linksys access point working as a wireless client to the router. 2.2mb ain't enough to stream HD. I have a brand new Samsung Series 650.
                                I'm just curious how much bandwidth is needed for 1080p streaming? I don't really intend on streaming 1080p video from the internet because my shitty ISP has me capped at 60GB/month.

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Re: Building my first HTPC

                                  They capped your bandwidtch? Lol recap it

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Re: Building my first HTPC

                                    Originally posted by Deft View Post
                                    I'm just curious how much bandwidth is needed for 1080p streaming?
                                    I'm really curious too... I've got the HULU-Plus (pay) service, and it stutters and chokes something awful. I'm convinced it is not a network issue, because I connect it directly to my public-facing static IP (no router) and it does the same thing.

                                    The TRACERT below is to hulu.com from my primary workstation inside a NAT'ed network. Note the asterisk for a timeout at the HULU hosting site at nlayer.net. My forwarding DNS is on my domain controller as a VM guest under ESXi 4.1.

                                    The connection is currently a 3.0 Mbps rated connection delivering a steady 2.5 Mbps. I've got a new request in to punch it up to 6 Mbps. The price is OK, and more than covered by the savings of kicking DirectTV to the curb.

                                    C:\>tracert hulu.com

                                    Tracing route to hulu.com [69.22.138.123]
                                    over a maximum of 30 hops:

                                    1 3 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1
                                    2 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms 1.235.125.209.transedge.com [209.125.235.1]
                                    3 13 ms 13 ms 13 ms 33.4.233.64.transedge.com [64.233.4.33]
                                    4 14 ms 14 ms 15 ms gi10-0.250.border1.rap.sjc.transedge.com [216.217.2.245]
                                    5 14 ms 14 ms 14 ms border1.eqx.sjc.transedge.com [216.217.0.40]
                                    6 24 ms 22 ms 21 ms equinix.xe-2-0-0.cr1.sjc1.us.nlayer.net [206.223.116.61]
                                    7 22 ms * 22 ms ae1-40g.ar2.sjc1.us.nlayer.net [69.22.143.118]
                                    8 22 ms 22 ms 23 ms ip-69-22-138-123.nlayer.net [69.22.138.123]

                                    Trace complete.

                                    C:\>nslookup 69.22.143.118
                                    Server: vm-dc1.office.compudox.com
                                    Address: 192.168.0.20

                                    Name: ae1-40g.ar2.sjc1.us.nlayer.net
                                    Address: 69.22.143.118


                                    C:\>nslookup 69.22.138.123
                                    Server: vm-dc1.office.compudox.com
                                    Address: 192.168.0.20

                                    Name: ip-69-22-138-123.nlayer.net
                                    Address: 69.22.138.123

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Re: Building my first HTPC

                                      1080p is a screen resolution, it's not a measure of content quality.
                                      You could stream 1080p in 16 colors and it wouldn't take much bandwidth at all.

                                      Streaming bandwidth will depend on the resolution, content quality, and the encoding method used as broadcast/streamed.
                                      MPEG2 is not the same as MPEG4 and so on..
                                      .
                                      Mann-Made Global Warming.
                                      - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.

                                      -
                                      Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

                                      - Dr Seuss
                                      -
                                      You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.
                                      -

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Re: Building my first HTPC

                                        For starters, the video streamers don't transmit movies in 16 colors.

                                        @Deft:
                                        MPEG2 is different from MPEG4

                                        Link to compression formats

                                        Link to Bandwidth of Commercial Streamers

                                        Bit Rate Comparison Table

                                        After kicking DirectTV to the curb, I installed an Antenna Craft U8000 8-bay antenna on a chimney mast. Using www.tvfool.com as a guide, I found I needed 40 feet above ground for LOS (line of sight) access to all the broadcasters in my area for perfect reception.

                                        Real world testing with the antenna at 20 feet above ground gives me worst-case 6 out of 10 bars on the new Samsung TV.
                                        The HDTV image quality is FAR better than anything I have yet to get from either HULU or NetFlix.
                                        Check out the last link above, and note that over the air broadcasts have a very high bit rate.

                                        HULU still chokes, stutters and stammers on my new 6 Mbs connection, so I canceled my paying subscription last night.
                                        NetFlix is far better at avoiding these delivery drop-outs.
                                        Last edited by bgavin; 10-28-2010, 08:17 AM. Reason: link clarity

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