MSI 6600GT what do you think about the cap choice?

[gonzo0815]

-------------------------Introduction---------------------------
I have a AMD Athlon 64 System i build for a friend there. This thing gaves me always headaches. it is build around
a ECS Nforce4-A939 board,
A64 3000 Winchester
2x 256Mb Kingston VS DDR400
and a MSi 6600GT Nx6600GT-TD128E, PCB 8983 v 2.0.

Now this system was problematic right after begining. If all 3d apps get frozen very soon. I managed to get it halfway stable with the NV betadriver, but random freezes in 3d apps are continiuely reported by user.
I swaped PSu with my Amacrox Frei Erde AX550GLN, wich did not help.

So i blamed the ECS board, as they are using usually poor ost caps. But i havve seen many users with no problems on that board. And even OC with this system was no problem, Prime95 memtest no problem only 3d apps.
I looked today again on this board, and i can`t say anything than that this board is well made in any way beside the OSt caps.
--------------------------END---------------------------------

Now i googled a bit and compared the similar build 6600Gt from other vendors and was a little supprised, as any other vendor used only Oscon or other solid polymer caps, only MSI has the balls to swappe 2 of them with 1000Uf KZG 6,3v caps.
All other brands are using 1200uF 4v SVP series. Immagine that. I think you all know the diffference.
I am tempted to swapp thos KZG with some MCZ 2200uF, wich will probably come close to the ESR specs of the Oscon caps. Shure it will look very ugly, but i only have some 2,5v 2700 Oscons there, i duno if this is ok for the Vcore of this card.

here some picture to see the difference:
MSi: http://www.eltris.pl/zdjecia/608.jpg
http://www.3dnews.ru/documents/12529...-front-big.jpg

The good ones:
http://www.ixbt.com/video2/images/xf...scan-front.jpg
http://images.google.de/imgres?imgur...lr%3D%26sa%3DN
http://www.kohryu.com/picture/inno/gf6000/6600gt.jpg

As you can see, all the same PCB i think.


PS: i linked the pics, as i duno if i void the copyright if i upload them. They are all marked....

[willawake]

Re: MSI 6600GT what do you think about the cap choice?

PS: i linked the pics, as i duno if i void the copyright if i upload them. They are all marked....

we are ok with that.

i am not suprised to see a vendor cheap out on one or two caps on a graphics card. i have seen that before with asus and even albatron mananged to squeeze in one evercon in an otherwise excellently specified card.

still i have seen cards work fine anyway and unless those KZG are going bad i think the card should be ok and maybe other problem. MCZ should be fine although not so good as oscon. even oscon svp there are better caps. anyway 2 caps, it is easy. the fan will crap out next i guarantee. lucky it is pci express so easy to source aftermarket unlike agp version with hsf at an angle.

i am running asus 6600gt agp with 81.98 driver nice. i replace the 2 skywell with mcz (even though it was a downgrade once i read the specs still working same performance in the end)

[gonzo0815]

Re: MSI 6600GT what do you think about the cap choice?

Well, on GFX cards like GF6600gt, with that comperatively high power needs, i think that it is not an optional gizmo to use som solid plymmer caps or anything close to the spec of those (most important the ESR for O/p caps). Even those cheaper brands with that PCB and VRM desing are obviousely using the more expensive stuff. This is the point wich makes me very uncofortable on MSI`S choice, especially, as MSI is for me well known for skimping their stuff beyond funtionality on the caps. The point is, that a comparable Oscon caps wil have an ESR of abouth 0.008 whereas the Chmicon probably have far more than the double. So multiply it by two and it would become obviousely, that the ripple current, the NV6600GT chip has to cope with is far more than significantly higher. I duno the spec of the NV chip, but if the other vendors have maginally reached the spec, than MSI is far away from that.

On some cheaper GFX cards, i am used to get bs caps and recap them as usuall, but this thing was not a bargain it was abouth 170€. This is for me even today not something cheap, even if there are people wich considering 300€ to 500€ as "normal" price range.

What do you suggest? should i leave hte caps and try an other may be better HSF? is heat the problem on those cards? ATM i am shure, that it is the GFX card. I can do anything with that system i can oc it, i can throw anything stresstest program on it w/o any issue. Only 3d apps have some freezes from time to time.

ATM i am waiting, what MSI will say abouth this problem, if they will provide a warranty replacement ok (not shure if it is covered anymore), if not i may be recap it or not, not shure about that yet.

[willawake]

Re: MSI 6600GT what do you think about the cap choice?

use rivatuner to check the temps. i will compare with you.
check for hsf nice contact with gpu
use known good driver like 81.98

can you try in another pc?

anything else can void the warranty. personally if you are sure it is the card i would send it back. it should be stable at stock speeds without mod even with those caps. on any pc with a good psu.

hsf looks adequate for stock or a little overclocked.

[gonzo0815]

Re: MSI 6600GT what do you think about the cap choice?

I am not shure if it is currently under waranty, i bought it IMHO in 2005. Have to chek that first. Are only those 6600GT that problematic with drivers or is this mandatory for todays NV cards`? With my older GF4 cards i never had problems, regardless wich driver used. What temp is ok? If i remeber corrrect it was about 78°C with 3dmark03 running severall loops.

PSU i currently my Amacrox AX500GLN, build by FSP. The other PSU is LC550 wich is currently running fine on my rig with AsrockDS2, A64@2600mhz and ATIx800@500/500Mhz. I think i can rule this out.
The other suspect thing is may be the cable modem, but i think this should not cause probems only in 3d apps.

[willawake]

Re: MSI 6600GT what do you think about the cap choice?

i think it has 3 year warranty.

mine is 40-45 idle and 70-80 in games
over 85 you would probably start seeing artefacts i guess, but depends on the card though.

well some of the drivers can be problematic. nforce chipsets themselves can be problematic also.

if you take the hsf fan off, clean all the crap off and use arctic silver instead it will be worth a few degrees. though 78 does not indicate a problem. if it was 100-120 then it would indicate something wrong with heatsink contact with gpu.