Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

[orange4boy]

Hi all,

Brand new here and just staring to learn about electronics.

I was having sound issues with this rig and decided to take it apart before I trashed it. The volume had to be kept very low or clipping of bass would happen along with strange squealy sounds. Sure enough found 3 bulged caps when I took it apart. It is in a hot place in the car and the CDs come out hot so I don't think it's a rubycon quality issue. One was split and the cover was partly melted off.

2- Rubycon 680uf 16V wxa 10mm x 10mm
1- 4700uf 16v px

I'm having a hard time finding a good quality replacement for the 680s because they have to be low profile.(one does at least)

In the meantime, because I'm really impatient, I replaced the two 680s, which were installed parallel, with one 2200uf 16v (scavenged from a power supply) which I moved into an available space close by.

It works much better now but still clips the bass and high volumes, so I'm going to get a Panasonic 4700uf 16v to replace the last bulged cap which sits right beside the mosfet.

So... questions are,

Should I try to replace the low profile with the closest I can find which may be crappy or should I get one good audio cap of double the capacitance, install in the new location, and be done with it?

Does someone know where I can get low profile excellent quality 680s?

Thanks a bunch.

[orange4boy]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

Found these low profile caps. Anyone care to weigh in on quality or alternatives?

low profile xicon 680uf 16v

[Krankshaft]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

I used to use Xicon on adapters and such when I started out I haven't had one fail yet. But their quality is unknown.

If you can't find the sizing in a reputable brand from Mouser, Digikey, or Newark. Try PMing Topcat.

If those turn up nothing try the Xicons if they will fit the original caps weren't low ESR so they should be fine. As long as it's their high temp series (the ones coloored radioactive green) . Not their 85C series colored sky blue.

Do you have any wiggle room on the height or is it a tight fit as it is?

[orange4boy]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

About 1 mm wiggle room on one of them. The other could be taller but I think mismatched is probably not a good idea. Turns out the link there is to a tall xicon when I checked the spec sheet.

I can't find any reference to the originals even on the ruby site: rubycon wxa to find out the specs.

[Toasty]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

Rubycon WXA - 10x9mm - 370ma - 105°C - 7.5mm lead spacing

[orange4boy]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

Thx. Toasty.

If I can't find a suitable mini 680uf should I get one good cap of double the capacitance, install in the new location, and be done with it?

[Toasty]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

I'm sure we could come up with the correct replacement somewhere.

Moving the caps about can raise its own set of problems. Scavenging parts is okay, if you can test what you scavenged. But blindly putting a cap in another (or 2 others) place, may worsen the problem.

The caps aren't that expensive. Likely < $10 with shipping.

Pics of this project please. The area around the caps too. What's nearby?

Note that this may very well be the output amps are done.

Toast

[orange4boy]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

I'll post some pics this evening.

Found some 680uf 16v caps that will fit just barely as I only have 12.5mm height. I could cut some of the CD player housing to fit taller ones but would rather not.

680uf 16v radial leaded 647-UHN1C681MPD mouser part number
HN series
10x 12.5
impedence 18
ripple 1760

680uf 16v radial leaded 647-UHM1C681MPD mouser pt#
HM series
10x 12.5
imp 25
ripple 1540

Now if only I could find a relpacement for the single 4700uf 16v 13mm x 25mm. The place where it is is so tight so the diameter has to be 14mm max. and that's pushing it. I have found the spec sheet but no supply.

[orange4boy]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

Here is the main power board. Bulged cap beside the torroid is a 4700uf 16v rubycon series px 12.5mm x 25mm. There is just about 1mm on each side of it. Above the mofset there is enough room to put something bigger and run wires down to the original mounting holes but I'm not sure that is a good idea. On the right, you can see my temporary solution to the replacement of the two rubycon 680uf 16v wxa series 10mm x 10mm. I have yet to find something close. The only close things I found were 10 x 12.5mm 680s which may just barely fit. I did find some 12.5 x 30mm 4700uf 16v units on ebay but as a lot of 150. I may email the seller for a deal on a couple and see if he bites.

Or I could install one of the taller ones on the back and the other in it's original location where there is plenty of headroom.

Each of these caps have a low ripple current rating and high impedance probably because they are so small. Everything I have found close is much better in both these areas. So i may see some improvement when I'm done.

The CD player takes up 90% of this space with a little left over by the heat sink.

I popped one of the bulged 680uf back in for the photo. It's the black one just below the brown nichicon in front of the red component. The plastic cover is half melted off.




Below is my temporary solution for the 2 680's. One 2200 of better quality. The stereo works much better now but the big bass still gets clipped (plus noise) when you turn it up too much. I think this has to do with the 4700uf which is also bulged. Please correct me if I'm wrong.



This is a top-down with the CD section installed showing the lack of space. I could install one sideways above it and run wires down or drill a hole in the case and install a larger size same rating on the back.

[Krankshaft]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

You can just use a larger cap and bend 90 degrees to the PCB.

Just heatshrink tube both of the leads so they don't short each other out.

Usually I try to avoid this but an extreme situation like this warrants it.

[Toasty]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

Bad spot for that cap. Right next to amp IC. Hot!

4700uF@16v - 12.5mm is likely a custom size. Most manufacturers top-out for that diameter at 3300-3900uF. 4700uF runs 16-18mm and up.

Panasonic FM or UCC KZE likely best but 3300uF limit.

Polys for the mini's are the best bet.

Toast

[orange4boy]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

You can just use a larger cap and bend 90 degrees to the PCB.

If I do this the leads will have to be about 25mm long and the cap will be over the torroid or the mofset. Which is the better bet?

Toasty,

What specs should I be looking for in a poly to replace the mini's?

Thanks for the input.

[orange4boy]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

Got busy and found myself some polymer caps that will fit the original spots:

Mouser #: 647-PLG1C471MDO1
Mfr. #: PLG1C471MDO1
Desc.: Polymer Aluminum Radial Capacitors 470uF 16V 105c Radial Leaded Low
RoHS: RoHS Compliant

I guess they don't make large polymer caps in the range that would replace my 4700uf 16v. Will have to do the extreme side or under mount fix.

Fun with solder.

[Toasty]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

Well, digging about yielded none that I found acceptable. Plus, I discovered that the leakage current of polymer caps in general is significantly higher than that of the WXA's you're replacing - 1504µA vs. 108µA in the case of the 470uF one you found, which is shy of the 680uF you need.

So, I withdraw my recommendation of going to polymers in this unit. I don't know for certain how that much excess leakage current will affect the circuit. It certainly wasn't designed for it.

At this point, I'd go with your plan to lay them down.

Try Nichicon HE:
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/...bwpIiP8A%3d%3d

It's a 10x16mm and leakage is < 108µA

or an HM if you can't spare the room:
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/...4ZITmwUaELcEoA

It's a 10x12.5mm and leakage is < 326µA

The 12.5, 3300uF should be fine on that amp filter. Get it and try it.

Toast

[orange4boy]

Re: Bad caps in Panasonic cq-c1300u car stereo (rubycon)

Finally got it done....almost.

Found some gold panasonic FM caps to replace the 680s and replaced the 4700s with elna RE3s which are not the best but very good. I figured an 85° elna is better than a 105°G-Luxon. They will probably not last long. The good news is I can fit a 14mm dia. cap in that spot which opens the horizon to much better caps.

The only other caps I could find locally were G-Luxon SMs or 25V "rubycon" YXAs. I used italics there because I think it is a fake ruby. Everything about it seems sloppy. A friend picked it up for me. I'll post a pic if anyone's interested.

Anyway it sounds great now.

Thanks for your help!

Now for project #2: The kenwood amp with one crackling channel and two bulged 71 v 8200uf ELNA's

Those, I can find. $10 each from Solen Elecronique